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Reddit mentions of Mark Canonizer of Paul: A New Look at Intertextuality in Mark's Gospel

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We found 4 Reddit mentions of Mark Canonizer of Paul: A New Look at Intertextuality in Mark's Gospel. Here are the top ones.

Mark Canonizer of Paul: A New Look at Intertextuality in Mark's Gospel
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Found 4 comments on Mark Canonizer of Paul: A New Look at Intertextuality in Mark's Gospel:

u/prosepectus · 13 pointsr/AcademicBiblical

These two were pretty mind-blowing and well-argued:

Mark Canonizer of Paul: A New Look at Intertextuality in Mark's Gospel by Tom Dykstra

Dykstra lays out a theory that the author of Mark used Paul's epistle to the Galatians heavily along with Homeric motifs.

The First Edition of the New Testament by David Trobisch

Trobisch suggests that, contrary to the generally accepted belief that the books of the NT circulated independently until the 4th century (when--to quote Wikipedia--"In his Easter letter of 367, Athanasius, Bishop of Alexandria, gave a list of the books that would become the twenty-seven-book NT canon..."), there was a combined edition of OT and NT as we know it published in the mid-second century. Trobisch believes Athanasius wasn't saying, "These should be canon" but rather "We accept this edition as canon".

And this is what I am currently reading:

Marcion and Luke-Acts: A Defining Struggle by Joseph B Tyson

The canon version of Luke-Acts was composed late (early to mid second century) and specifically as a reaction to Marcionite Christianity.


u/witchdoc86 · 8 pointsr/DebateEvolution

My recommendations from books I read in the last year or so (yes, these are all VERY STRONG recommends curated from ~100 books in the last year) -

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Science fiction-

Derek Kunsken's The Quantum Magician (I would describe it as a cross between Oceans Eleven with some not-too-Hard Science Fiction. Apparently will be a series, but is perfectly fine as a standalone novel).

Cixin Lu's very popular Three Body Problem series (Mixes cleverly politics, sociology, psychology and science fiction)

James A Corey's The Expanse Series (which has been made into the best sci fi tv series ever!)

Hannu Rajaniemi's Quantum Thief series (Hard science fiction. WARNING - A lot of the early stuff is intentionally mystifying with endless terminology that’s only slowly explained since the main character himself has lost his memories. Put piecing it all together is part of the charm.)

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Fantasy-

James Islington's Shadow of What was Lost series (a deep series which makes you think - deep magic, politics, religion all intertwined)

Will Wight's Cradle series (has my vote for one of the best fantasy series ever written)

Brandon Sanderson Legion series (Brandon Sanderson. Nuff said. Creative as always)

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Manga -

Yukito Kishiro's Alita, Battle Angel series (the manga on what the movie was based)

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Non-Fiction-

Jonathan Haidt's The Righteous Mind - Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion (and how we are not as rational as we believe we are, and how passion works in tandem with rationality in decision making and is actually required for good decisionmaking)

Rothery's Geology - A Complete Introduction (as per title)

Joseph Krauskopf's A Rabbi's Impressions of the Oberammergau Passion Play, available to read online for free, including a fabulous supplementary of Talmud Parallels to the NT (a Rabbi in 1901 explains why he is not a Christian)

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Audiobooks -

Bob Brier's The History of Ancient Egypt (as per title - 25 hrs of the best audiobook lectures. Incredible)

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Academic biblical studies-

Richard Elliot Friedman's Who Wrote The Bible and The Exodus (best academic biblical introductory books into the Documentary Hypothesis and Qenite/Midian hypothesis)

Israel Finkelstein's The Bible Unearthed (how archaelogy relates to the bible)

E.P. Sander's Judaism: Practice and Belief, 63BCE-66CE ​(most detailed book of what Judaism is and their beliefs, and one can see from this balanced [Christian] scholar how Christianity has colored our perspectives of what Jews and Pharisees were really like)

Avigdor Shinan's From gods to God (how Israel transitioned from polytheism to monotheism)

Mark S Smith's The Early History of God (early history of Israel, Canaanites, and YHWH)

James D Tabor's Paul and Jesus: How the Apostle Transformed Christianity (as per title)

Tom Dykstra's Mark Canonizer of Paul (engrossing - will make you view the gospel of Mark with new eyes)

Jacob L Wright's King David and His Reign Revisited (enhanced ibook - most readable book ever on King David)

Jacob Dunn's thesis on the Midianite/Kenite hypothesis (free pdf download - warning - highly technical but also extremely well referenced)

u/ManUpMann · 3 pointsr/HistoricOrMythicJesus

>I've read Dykstra's book and I think some examples of parallels are stronger than others (the same is true of MacDonald). Dykstra's case for Mark using Paul's letters is not really decisive. I think he shows it's possible, but I'm not sure I saw any bulletproof examples of Mark surely using Paul.

Carrier mentions Dykstra a few times in this web-article

> "Similarly, Mark 8:31-33 crafts Jesus’s rebuke of Peter after Paul’s rebuke of Peter (Galatians 2:11-14). The many congruences are well analyzed in Dykstra (Mark, pp. 97-99). For example, Paul says, “Am I now seeking the favor or men, or of God?”; Jesus says, 'You are not thinking of the things of God but of the things of man'."

Then Carrier says

>"Then Mark 8:34-37 adapts material from Philippians 3:7-8. For example, Paul says, “Whatever gain [kerdê] I had, I counted as a loss [zêmian]” and “I suffered the loss [zêmian] of all…that I may gain [kêrdêsô] Christ”; Jesus says, “What does it profit a man to gain [kêrdêsai] the whole world and lose [zêmiôthênai] his life?” rather than, Jesus explains, “losing” all for Christ and his gospel in exchange for eternal life. The links continue (as summarized by Dykstra), but you get the point."
>
>And on and on…

  • Mark also reifies Paul’s teachings about Christian baptism being an adoption by God as his son (compare Mark 1:11 with Romans 8:14-17 and Galatians 3:26-27).
  • Mark repeatedly has Jesus refer to his future Christian followers as “children” (at least thirteen times), just as Paul did (at least twenty-eight times ...
  • Mark is conspicuously as fond of the “stumbling block” metaphor for sin as Paul was ...
  • Mark gets the idea from Paul (in Philippians 3:5-6) that “Pharisees” persecute Christians ...
  • Mark gets the idea from Paul (in Galatians 2:7-9 and 1 Corinthians 15:5) that there were originally twelve apostles and that the “pillars” were Peter, James and John, with Peter at the top, and James and John his right hand men; and in exact accord with Paul’s criticism of them, Mark depicts them as hypocritical and faltering (as well analyzed in Dykstra, Mark, pp. 109-25).

    ​

    > "Even overall Mark’s whole Gospel feels like it has been inspired by Paul’s teachings. Its narrative is inordinately concerned with Gentiles and the criticism of Jewish legalism. Jesus is portrayed as constantly trashing Jewish laws and traditions, embarrassing and pissing off their advocates, even while justifying it all as a superior actualization of Judaism—just as Paul does throughout his letters (see Dykstra, Mark, pp. 82-90). And Jesus visits Gentile lands, dines with Gentiles, interacts with Gentiles favorably quite a lot, and has even carefully structured his whole book to emphasize this fact (see OHJ, pp. 414-17, with further support in Dykstra, Mark, pp. 69-82, 131-32). It’s all an important part of Mark’s message—which makes little sense as history, but perfect sense as a narrativization of Paul’s mission and theology."

    And

    >Specific Examples

  • ...Dykstra also makes a good case that Mark has modeled his John the Baptist after Paul (Mark, pp. 147-48).

    ​

    >"There is actually a great deal more than that. If one surveys all the literature I listed at the beginning, one will find numerous other parallels analyzed (e.g. on shared vocabulary, see Dykstra, Mark, pp. 143-47), as well as further and corroboratory analysis of the examples I have listed. The extent of them is simply too vast to be accidental."
u/Charlarley · 1 pointr/AcademicBiblical

Tom Dykstra's 2012 Mark Canonizer of Paul: A New Look at Intertextuality in Mark's Gospel has some interesting ideas

> "For over 150 years the idea that Mark used the Pauline epistles has been recurring in New Testament research. Now, in the work of Tom Dykstra, wide-ranging work and thoughtful, the truth of that idea emerges with a clarity it never had before. The result is to give a fresh sense of the origin and nature of Mark, of all the New Testament books, and of the quest for history.”

Thomas Brodie, Director, Dominican Biblical Institute, author of The Birthing of the New Testament

> “Tom Dykstra draws connections between Paul and the Gospel of Mark that are stunning, surprising, and original, and leave readers with a sense that the evidence deserves a better interpretation than traditional Synoptic models can offer. Well argued, easy to read, immersed in the relevant current exegetical discussion, the book fascinates, provokes, and encourages to think outside the box.”

David Trobisch, author of The First Edition of the New Testament

Paul Nadim Tarazi, Professor of Biblical Studies, St. Vladimir’s Seminary -
> “In addition to its main focus on Mark, this book is a lucid introduction to early church history, oral tradition, the gospels’ genre, and how to understand scripture in general.”