Reddit mentions of Ogilvy on Advertising

Kotler & Keller - Principles of Marketing Management

Ogilvy on Advertising

Ooh, I know this! So, first read everyone else's responses. They're probably smarter than I. I was in your shoes about 10 years ago. I was working for a small film company and taking on any job that had any element of copywriting in it. (If I got my boss coffee, I'd write a story about it and send to all my friends.) Then, I got a call from a CD I'd met at a party that I have an interview "later this week." I called all my advertising friends. This is a compilation of the advice that I think helped me land the job:

• Bring examples of your writing. 5-10 things that show you can do the work. Be prepared to discuss them, what you learned while writing them, and how you'd improve them.
  
  
• Update your resume to focus on the writing aspects of your work history.
  
  
• Research the people interviewing. Find some shared interests and the value you'll bring to the team.
  
  
• During the interview, they told me I wasn't ready for the position. I asked for the opportunity to prove that I was. I think they appreciated the pushback. I wrote a pro-bono Point-of-sale, which they paid me for so they could sell it to the client.
  
  
• The only time I ever used an AP stylebook was to win an argument with my CD. Everything is subjective in advertising.
  
  
• If you have basic competency, copywriters differentiate based on relationships, ability to execute, and life experience. Focus on these for your interview.
  
  
• Some books that changed how I see my job as a copywriter:
  
  Ogilvy on Advertising
  
  It's not how good you are...
  Selling the invisible
  
  Keep in mind, I focused on the creative side bc the agency I worked for put ZERO value on research. They (wrongly) thought it was a waste of money, and I wasn't going to convince them otherwise. They also didn't care much for conversions. They simply wanted clever writing. Your situation may be different. Research first, and focus on the important bits. Good luck, and feel free to PM me if you want to discuss.
  
  As for your lowball salary, everything is negotiable. Be honest. Tell them you realize they're taking a risk by interviewing fresh talent, and you'd like to revisit it after 6 months or so.

> having things taught to you

Well. There's two interpretations of this. 1. I take a class or 2. I do my research.

I was reading Ogilvy's "Ogilvy on Advertising" and he makes the point early that you can't do your job without doing the research, basically,


>" Advertising people who ignore research are as dangerous as generals who ignore decodes of enemy signals.
"

I think this current generation is a bit caught up in education via traditional models because it's been packaged and sold so well by everyone from the federal government to their 4th grade teachers lecturing about college.

I am not saying you are. I'm just saying it's a common assumption that to be good at product design for example you should enroll at the prestigious university located in some tiny town that had the first product design b.s. in the country.

In fact. Just do your research. Now the Internet can make this overwhelming. Especially if what you intend to learn isn't all that strict.

Myself? I've chosen to learn the following:

Category 1:

• typography
  
• web design
  
• web development
  
• web application development
  
• web application design
  
• user interface/interaction design
  
• product design
  
• graphic design
  
  Category 2:
  
  
• marketing
  
• advertising
  
• sales
  
  Category 3:
  
  
• cinematography
  
• editing
  
• directing
  
• producing
  
• motion graphics
  
  I'm at different places in every one of those fields. And conventional wisdom has already told me a million times to fuck off because I'll never be good enough at one thing to get a job doing any of them. And I still don't know if they're not wrong. I know I've gotten to actually work doing some degree of all those fields and I never wished it was someone else doing the work. And I know I'm not as good as I want to be. But imagine if I wanted to learn all of that stuff in the traditional model? I'd never graduate, I'd never be certified, I'd never have any kind of credibility. Instead I read as much as I can stomach. I read books, I practice problems, and I make deliverables that put food on my table. I try to do as much research as possible before committing an idea to my brain. And once something is committed I continue to follow that idea down the rabbit hole.