Reddit mentions of Tune to Win: The art and science of race car development and tuning

I could go on for hours about basic vehicle dynamics tbh, but suffice it to say that there are countless variables that go into determining handling characteristics. If you're really interested, the definitive introductory resource is this book, which if you can find used would probably be best. It's certainly not an easy read.

For a more accessible read, this book is pretty great too. It's also much cheaper.

IMO, you should probably do a bit more research about common solutions that people have for your particular car. I'd recommend, before changing anything, learning a bit more about basic vehicle dynamics. You don't even need to learn fancy math or anything, just kind of get an idea of what changes generally affect which characteristics.

I'd say to keep remembering that what you're trying to set up is a student run business. Pretend you're Elon Musk trying to tell people how electric is the next best thing in the automotive market, which may be true, but the public (and more importantly, endorsers such as the school) are not going to be swayed easily without proof of concept.

Before I go on, I was the president of the VCU FSAE team in Richmond, VA up until last month (June 2017). The team was in the same predicament as yours 10 years ago, and was getting threatened with the discarding of the half-finished vehicle up every other year until our first competition at Lincoln 2017 (for internal combustion). Richmond is the capital of Virginia, so I'm very familiar with the difficulties of building a vehicle in the city as you've described above. That being said, the information I'm providing is from a team that didn't pass the Noise/Kill-Switch tests at tech inspection, and I'm probably going to be one of the least experienced people to respond to this thread.

Start with looking at the paperwork required for competition, particularly the Business Logic Case. Here, you outline your goals for the vehicle and why you want to build it in the first place and who you will sell it to. Do you want to make the car cheap and market it to a broader, lower income market? Or do you want to make a high cost vehicle which comes with options such as paddle shifting, adjustable front and rear wings, and a carbon fiber monocoque. Every design decision that is made on the car after deciding on your market and budget needs to coincide with the Business Logic Case, which you are allowed to modify if the team decides that they want to market differently for whatever reason. The car should be designed around the Business Logic Case, and we messed up by designing our Business Logic Case around the car, and that's why I want to mention this so strongly.

From there, you'll probably want to assign a few people who have taken their economics/business courses to start on the presentation. There are a lot of things in the presentation that the judges love to see, such as factory layouts, tooling requirements, and labor costs that take a lot of time to prepare and assess accurately.

Design work can start alongside the Presentation, beginning with the chassis. There are a few key points I'd like to throw in first:

1. Have a full 3D model of the entire car before building or ordering anything, unless it's for proof-of-concept or school presentation purposes and can be stored in your student org society room.
   
   
2. Leave yourself a lot of space inside the chassis to work. Leave large tolerances and assure that everything will fit and be able to slot in to its spot. It also helps your team from getting frustrated when you learn that you'll have to drop the engine for the 5th or 6th time this month.
   
   
3. There is a "standard" chassis outlined in each chassis sub-section in the rulebook, and I highly recommend starting with this, as it is guaranteed to pass in the Structural Equivalency Spreadsheet. (Note: The same applies for the Impact Attenuator and Impact Attenuator Data Sheet. A standard one does not require real-world testing results).
   
   
4. Keep as many mechanical items in the car as possible. I would not advise creating paddle-shifters, traction control elements, or any other systems that cannot be fixed with duct-tape, JB Weld, or zip ties at competition. I don't really agree with the decision to go electric for your first car, but even still, there will be more people who can work on mechanical elements in the vehicle instead of electrical elements, simply because electrical vehicles are not the norm in industry yet.
   
   
5. Every system needs a design and cost report!!! Being a first year team, it's going to take forever to get your first car driving. Make sure that every design on the car has a report that outlines why the design team made certain decisions that what the results of their analyses were. A full bill of materials will also need to be done upon the completion of each system. Just make sure that no significant information is lost when people inevitably begin to graduate from your school and your team.
   
   
6. Make sure that every parameter in the Design Spec Sheet is known before a particular system design is "completed". There are a lot of weird values that they want, and it's very likely that only the people who worked on that system of the car will be able to fill in the blanks.
   
   
7. Don't use or buy any parts that aren't free or discounted. This was something I asked a lot of teams about at Nebraska, and pretty much all of them abided by this.
   
   So as a summary, compile all the paperwork that you'll require for competition, and begin working on it as soon as you can. It should go something in the starting order of:
   
   
8. Business Logic Case
   
9. Design Report (from each team, and then compile and shorten to the 6-page FSAE version)
   
10. Design Spec Sheet
    
11. Structural Equivalency Spreadsheet
    
12. Cost Report
    
13. Impact Attenuator Data Sheet
    
    With all of this completed, you should be able to make a very solid case to anybody at the school for building space. I encourage you to keep trying to get work space as you put together the virtual stuff in the vehicle however.
    
    I will leave these resources as well for you to look through:
    
    
14. Emily Anthony's "Key points for a successful Formula SAE team" article
    
15. Carroll Smith's Engineer to Win, Tune to Win, and Prepare to Win books. Everyone on the team should read these as soon as possible before the design of the car starts or gets too far in.
    
    
16. FSAE Forum Book List. Encourage team members to look here to order books before beginning design work on the vehicle. Chassis team members order books on structural components, intake/exhaust get books like Four Stroke Performance Tuning, and etc.
    
    Good luck, and let me know if you have any other questions!

Not my thing, but dude, kudos to you for build finish and worksmanship. I'm really impressed.

You are going to have wheelbase changes as you corner, and the rear is too narrow for the front end. I would have made that rear tire as wide as possible. It will tend oversteer a lot and will be difficult to use the throttle to balance the vehicle. Chassis could use more triangulation too, but from a glance, the tubing looks big enough to hold.

If I can suggest a reading, please check out https://www.amazon.com/Tune-Win-science-development-tuning/dp/0879380713

Race Car Vehicle Dynamics (Milliken)

Tune to Win

Good Luck!

If you're really interested in it, a good book to read is Tune To Win by Carroll Smith. It was written in the 70's so it's a bit dated but still plenty relevant, especially to new drivers/engineers. But if you're studying finance you probably already have more than enough on your plate.

Basically, driving a race car is about managing weight transfer to balance the car around each corner. The more load one corner or end of the car has on it the more grip it has. The driver controls lateral load transfer with the steering wheel and longitudinal load transfer with the gas and brake pedals.

Tuning the suspension is another way to influence how load is directed around the car. For example, if the front springs are very stiff, the front of the car won't squat as low under braking, less weight is transferred forward so the rear of the car has more grip. So that's why if you're struggling with turn-in understeer you might want to soften either the front sprigs or front (low-speed) compression damping. Alternatively you could also soften the rear low-speed rebound damping (take not that when talking about dampers, speed doesn't refer to speed of the car, but of the piston traveling through the fluid in the damper. Think high speed=bumps, low speed=weight transfer).

Anti-roll bars are a bit different since they manage lateral load. They also link suspension systems together, so if you hit a kerb or a bump with the right front wheel, the left front will feel it as well. Very generally, softer=more grip. The book I referenced goes into a lot more detail than I can, but I like to think of it as making that end of the car more malleable. Although I don't think that's entirely technically accurate. It also may be worth noting that when tuning the car, anti-roll bars are the first thing real-world teams play with, and a lot of cars have anti-roll bars adjustable from the cockpit. The team uses it as a sort of guide to lead other larger setup changes.

To your second question, the car can behave differently in different parts of the corner. It might feel great when you turn in (usually at which point the car is slowing-meaning forward weight transfer), but then lose all front grip when you're accelerating out of the corner. This means that you're transferring too much weight to the rear under power, so the solution is to stiffen rear springs or low-speed damper compression. If it happens earlier in the corner, when there is more lateral load, then stiffening the rear anti-roll bar (or the opposite, softening the front) might be a better solution.

This isn't even getting into things like camber/castor/toe, which I don't really understand enough myself. The general rule of thumb is to try to keep the outer/middle/inner tire temps as even as possible. I think it's also common opinion that cars should always have at least a little bit of toe-in. Edit: This video has a good overview.

Your third point is absolutely correct. Race car setup is an unsolvable equation. There are too many interdependent variables for there to ever be an ultimate solution. Add on top of that different driving styles and one setup might work well for one driver and be trash for another. It's more of an art than a precise science.

I hope that helps!

DrivingFast.net

TurnFast.com

"The Six Most Important Things You'll Learn At Racing School" (Jalopnik.com article)

"Performance Driving Illustrated" by Ross Bentley (PDF e-book)

"Ultimate Speed Secrets: The Complete Guide to High-Performance and Race Driving" by Ross Bentley (book)

"RaceLogic Advanced Circuit Driving Techniques" (PDF e-book)

Rapid-Racer.com Suspension Tuning

"Tune to Win" by Carroll Smith (book)

This question has been asked a bunch of times, but the one post I've found the most helpful was /u/that_video_art_guy's response in this post. For quick reference, here's the copy/paste:



I've read many of these books, I'm partial to the mechanics and team member books but find all of them to be very enjoyable.


The Super Collective Super list of Super Good F1 Books:

Mechanics/Team Members


[Life in the Pit Lane: Mechanic's Story of the Benetton Grand Prix Year](
http://www.amazon.com/Life-Pit-Lane-Mechanics-Benetton/dp/0760300267/ref=sr_1_5?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1356716346&sr=1-5&keywords=steve+matchett) - Steve Matchett

[The Mechanic's Tale: Life in the Pit-Lanes of Formula One](
http://www.amazon.com/Mechanics-Tale-Life-Pit-Lanes-Formula/dp/0752827839/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1356716346&sr=1-1&keywords=steve+matchett) - Steve Matchett

The Chariot Makers: Assembling the Perfect Formula 1 Car - Steve Matchett

Team Lotus: My View From the Pitwall - Peter Warr

Jo Ramirez: Memoirs of a Racing Man - Jo Ramirez

Art of War - Five Years in Formula One - Max Mosley, Adam Parr, Paul Tinker

Tales from the Toolbox: A Collection of Behind-the-Scenes Tales from Grand Prix Mechanics - Michael Oliver, Jackie Stewart


Technical Books

Red Bull Racing F1 Car: Haynes Owners' Workshop Manual

McLaren M23: 1973 Haynes Owners' Workshop Manual

Lotus 72: 1970 Haynes Owners' Workshop Manual

Tune to Win: The art and science of race car development and tuning - Carroll Smith

Engineer to Win - Carroll Smith

Nuts, Bolts, Fasteners and Plumbing Handbook AKA: Screw to Win - Carroll Smith

Race Car Vehicle Dynamics: Problems, Answers and Experiments - Doug Milliken

Chassis Design: Principles and Analysis - William F. Milliken, Douglas L. Milliken, Maurice Olley

The Racing & High-Performance Tire: Using Tires to Tune for Grip & Balance - Paul Haney


Technical Driving

Ultimate Speed Secrets: The Complete Guide to High-Performance and Race Driving - Ross Bentley

Going Faster! Mastering the Art of Race Driving - Carl Lopez

Working the Wheel - Martin Brundle


Drivers and Rivalry's

Senna Versus Prost: The Story of the Most Deadly Rivalry in Formula One - Malcolm Folley

The Limit: Life and Death on the 1961 Grand Prix Circuit - Michael Cannell

Winning Is Not Enough: The Autobiography - Sir Jackie Stewart

Shunt: The Story of James Hunt - Tom Rubython

Alex Zanardi: My Sweetest Victory: A Memoir of Racing Success, Adversity, and Courage - Alex Zanardi, Gianluca Gasparini, Mario Andretti.

It Is What It Is: The Autobiography - David Coulthard

Flat Out, Flat Broke: Formula 1 the Hard Way! - Perry McCarthy The Black Stig, Damon Hill

F1 Through the Eyes of Damon Hill: Inside the World of Formula 1 - Damon Hill, Photography: Sutton Images


People Of F1

Life at the Limit: Triumph and Tragedy in Formula One - Professor Sid Watkins

Beyond the Limit - Professor Sid Watkins

I Just Made The Tea: Tales from 30 years inside Formula 1 - Di Spires

Bernie: The Biography of Bernie Ecclestone - Susan Watkins


Picture Books

McLaren The Cars: Updated 2011 Edition

Art of the Formula 1 Race Car - Stuart Codling, James Mann, Peter Windsor, Gordon Murray

If you're not opposed to reading, this is a fantastic book on the subject of suspension and aero tuning
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0879380713/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_Ra-Dyb063XJNZ

Tune to Win: The art and science of race car development and tuning

It's never too early to start.

Here's the video you were looking for!

You can also get it in book form, which I think goes into more detail.

If you're interested in going even deeper, Drive To Win by Carroll Smith is a good one, and you'll even learn what it takes to be successful in real-life racing.

Tune To Win also really good if you're interested in learning about set-up, but if you're just starting out then focusing on driving is by far the most important thing. The skippy car doesn't have many set-up options anyways.

Get the STi springs. Subaru spent a couple hundred grand engineering them for a reason.

Are the strut bars bumping you up a class? If so ditch them and run in a more proper class.

As for the bodyroll, that might be a driver mod. Too much braking, not enough gas. Scoobies don't like lifting. That being said, your first problem is absolutely lack of suspension travel due to the drop. 1.6" is a TON of lost travel, and those rates are per inch, which you've chopped off.

I don't think your spring rate is too high, STi's are over 200 stock. But those Epic springs are 100% for looks, and not for handling. Even says so on their website.

>Epic Engineering springs are designed to give your Subaru a more aggressive stance, and increase the intensity of the driving experience while maintaining a smooth and comfortable ride

Further:

>The decrease in ride height effectively lowers the coefficient of gravity, as well as the front roll center and hence inclines the vehicle roll axis further up to the rear.

And, as anyone who's read "Tune to Win" can tell you, lowering the front roll center will promote understeer.

So change the springs for the STi ones. Takes an hour if you DIY and borrow the spring compressors from Autozone (or buy a set for like $40). Just make sure you get the cone washer on top of the struts going the right way!

I totally remember reading about this in Tune to Win, but I forget the reason why it was.

It may have had to do with the fact that they used Swing Axle front suspension, so the camber angle change during body roll was the opposite of what it is with double wishbone (the reason people run negative camber these days).

If you read these four Carroll Smith books you'll be more knowledgeable than just about every person here. They are by an large the foundational bibles of modern race car building, maintenance, and design. Don't let any engineer tell you differently. All of this info is easily applied to motorcycle mechanics, design, and engineering.

https://www.amazon.com/Tune-Win-science-development-tuning/dp/0879380713/ref=asap_bc?ie=UTF8

https://www.amazon.com/Engineer-Win-Carroll-Smith/dp/0615754090/ref=asap_bc?ie=UTF8

https://www.amazon.com/Fasteners-Plumbing-Handbook-Motorbooks-Workshop/dp/0879384069/ref=asap_bc?ie=UTF8

https://www.amazon.com/Prepare-Win-Bolts-Professional-Preparation/dp/0615547338/ref=asap_bc?ie=UTF8

Tune To Win would be my recommendation by Carroll Smith, old but very informative.

I started to read "The Perfect Corner" and whilst there is nothing wrong with it, it's not my go to book, but that is just my personal opinion which doesn't mean it's right for everyone.

>And weight on that tire would just be taking away from your other tires.

Except that's a good thing...

For tires to generate lateral force, they need a normal load on them (i.e. weight) and they need to slip (hence slip angle).

So by that logic, you just want to pile on more weight and you get more lateral force. This is true, but the problem is that pneumatic tires have a sensitivity to that weight. This means that for more and more load you pile on them, the less lateral force you get back. It's why race cars want to always be as low as possible, you transfer less weight.

Essentially, because the weight got transferred off the tire, it lost more lateral force capability than the outside tire gained.

If you don't believe me, read either:

The Racing & High Performance Tire by Haney

or

Tune to Win by Carroll Smith

or

Fundamentals of Vehicle Dynamics by Gillespie

or

RCVD by Milliken and Milliken

or you can choose to ignore a random person on the internet that says he has several years of engineering experience for several racing series.