(Part 2) Best products from r/BackYardChickens

You seem to have all the basics.

[1] pair the dog and chicks while both are as young as possible.

[2] get a "herding" dog breed.


Forgive me for going into some unwanted tangents on herd training.... "chicken herding" is kind of a small hobby for me.


I have worked with an Australian Cattle Dog. The dog was 10 years old when I started. At this point I can let the dog out when they are free ranging, I can even let the dog into the coop and all she will do is sniff and nip the chickens. Unfortunately, I did not get the dog young enough to train her hunting instinct out. When the birds fly, flutter or cause a commotion - and I don't already have her in "herding mode", my dog goes into "hunting mode"... and the chickens are as good as dead.


One way to pair animals, is to introduce the chicks to a dog while she is giving birth. This is a sure fire way to eliminate the kill instinct and instill a protective nature if the dog accepts the chicks as part of her litter. If it doesn't "take", the mother will kill the chicks. I can not speak to how this works when new chicks are added to your coop, but I have seen it done with one batch first hand - and it is amazing. So all in all, this is not the best way to pair. But if you have the opportunity, it's worth a shot.


As far as herd dog training.... it is a lot of work. Herding Dogs are very loyal but very high maintenance. They require a daily routine, loving discipline, concise vocabulary, regular "training workouts", etc. If you have not done it before, I would warn against accepting every piece of advice from house dog trainers and most dog club enthusiasts. While most of their advice works for house training a dog, herd training is as individual as say, training a hunting dog.


Methods I used: [1] segregating dog and chickens in coop for increasing intervals until the dog doesn't get excited about bird presence. [2] allowing a rooster and dog in the same area. (I'm not going to cry if my dog kills a rooster) [3] training the dog to come when I say come, reverse direction when I say "heit" along with various other [commands] (http://www.herding-dog-training-border-collie-sheepdog-dvd.com/sheepdog-terminology/) Note, the author doesn't use standard vocabulary that people use at competitions. [4] once the dog has a good command of being directed, I keep him/her on a leash and we herd together. [5] Once I feel confident in the dog's ability to herd on a leash, we graduate to unleashed herding. I've also encouraged my dog to chase deer, turkeys, etc off my property when she sees them. And bark from the inside when they are present. This has taken a long time to sink in, but she will now alert me that a deer is in the yard, run it to the property line, and come back for a piece of summer sausage. Summer sausage is a huge incentive for her.


I would proceed by finding a herding breed you like (I love [australian cattle dogs] (https://www.reddit.com/r/blueheelers/)), finding a book particular for herd training, and finding an enthusiast group for your breed. I will note, the reason why I am so much a proponent of specific breeds, is because I've tried herd training a few labs.... and I've tried with one cattle dog. The difference between the four labs and the cattle dog is night and day. Now granted, labs are the ideal chicken killing dog, and cattle dogs are one of the best herding dogs... and I only have experience with two breeds - so I am by no means an expert. Terriers seem like they would be a headache. Or, at least, they don't seem like a good match for me. I would argue that pairing the right breed for you is very important, so if you are a fan of terriers - and they have a history of herding.... go with it. I would definitely get a herding breed, though. Those dogs have been selectively bred over generations based on their ability to overcome their kill instinct.


Other things I've heard... cattle and sheep are the easiest to train with. chickens are the hardest.... so your jumping in the deep end. Granted it sounds like you just want the dog to guard, and not herd... but the skill set is very similar, and I would argue mutually beneficial.


My favorite trainer in the world is Cesar Milan. I love his zen-like, accept the dog for the dog he/she is method, and also the idea of being the "pack leader". His work rehabilitating fighting dogs in L.A. was pretty awesome. Unfortunately, I've found very little of his work on herders. Just one episode of his [show] (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qd0UxayRWog) and a few [blog] (https://www.cesarsway.com/about-dogs/breeds/bringing-out-the-breed) posts. There are a lot of books out there. a and [b] (http://www.amazon.com/Stockdog-Savvy-Jeanne-Joy-Hartnagle-Taylor/dp/1577791061/ref=pd_bxgy_14_img_3?ie=UTF8&refRID=0A4Z50JV4JYV6HYWHHQD) got good reviews on amazon. I've heard about Holland's book, it's supposed to be one of the most well-read books on herding dogs. I can't speak for it personally.

I think it is a viable plan and it sounds like you'll do just fine. I am probably different from many people on this sub as I don't spend much time with my chickens at all and they do just fine. My chickens are not pets - they exist to provide eggs. I treat them well and they have a good life but I do not go to the extent that some people do to protect, enrich, cool, or heat their flock. I have never had a sickness or problem other than losing a hen to predators every now and then, which is just a fact of life.

Four hens is extremely manageable. We set up a hanging feeder like this one and a hanging water bucket with nipples like this. The food is refilled about once a week with four hens and the water about twice depending on the size of the bucket. We give them kitchen scrap treats several times a week. Otherwise they are pretty self sufficient. They put themselves in and out of the coop each day, they manage their own needs with the resources they have. I feel like a lot of people don't give chickens enough credit. They know what to do. They've been doing it for tens of millions of years. It is actually cool to watch them do instinctually things that they have no way of knowing how to do.

The one thing I would say to you is not to mess around with ex battery hens. I haven't had them and I know nothing about them but it seems like they would require extra work and care and attention. It seems like you don't want to do that so if it were me I would just start with young yens of a breed that are strong layers like Rhode Island Reds - if you have those in what I am guessing is Australia. They will be less work and hassle which is what it seems you want. Good luck!

Sounds like you're well along the path to becoming a crazy chicken lady--welcome aboard :)

Honestly, you don't need most of the stuff on your list. Chickens need an off-the-ground roost in a predator-proof space to sleep, access to water and food, a safe place to lay eggs, and that's about it. Feel free to go crazy with extra perches in the run, toys, mirrors, swings, etc. but don't feel like they are necessary. My chickens have far more fun digging through a big leaf pile than any other amusement I've devised.

Your chickens may have issues learning to use the treadle feeder. Mine have yet to manage it, so I changed to using a hanging feeder for the rodent resistance.

Sand as litter is controversial, with some bloggers claiming it's the best and easiest and others claiming it's unhealthful. You probably want to switch to what's sold in the USA as "builder's sand" rather than "play sand". It's coarser and much cheaper, and less likely to cause respiratory distress.

On constructing a dust bath: I'd only recommend this if they don't have access to dirt in their run. I meticulously created a beautiful dust bath in a sawed-off wine barrel, with the so-called perfect mix of sand and dirt, but my hens literally never used it. They preferred to dig their own dust baths in their run's litter or in my yard.

One optional addition is Storey's Guide to Raising Chickens; I'm not sure how much overlap there is with the book you already have, but Storey's is excellent.

I'd also consider buying nest pads, though you can just use wood shavings.

I personally find sweet PDZ to be helpful, and if you're using sand as litter (I use deep litter) you'll probably find it even more so. It absorbs ammonia, odors, and moisture.

Reading a book about chickens may make it seem harder than it is. Silkies are great birds. Here is some practical advice. If you are buying hatching eggs that will get shipped through the mail, make sure that you get at least 6 if you want three birds. If you cannot have roosters, then get even more eggs. My experience is hatching eggs get damaged in shipping, so the hatching rate could be very low. I recently got 10+ Japanese hatching eggs. Only one shows signs of life. I opened some of the bad ones and the yolk was broken.

Chicks will need a feed that has higher protein and no calcium. Most commercial feeds will explain the ages to use what feed. Go to a local store that sells chicken supplies and look at the feeds.

The nipple type feeders are nice, as stuff doesn't end up in the water. Birds can easily learn to use them, but you may have to nudge and show them a bit. This one has worked well for me: https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B00JXUAD0K/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_dp_T1_tLauzb7DRFWVV

Silkies can easily handle below freezing conditions. They have a pea comb so aren't prone to frostbite. They also have great feathers. I don't do much of anything to make things cool or warm. Make sure they have access to shade and water. They will pant kinda like dogs to cool off. They also use their comb to regulate body temperatures.

A 3-4 chicken sized coop will work for easily six silkies, as they are a small bantam birds. Good ventilation is important for a coop, as a build of ammonia from chicken poop can damage chicken lungs.

Bantam birds are especially vulnerable to hawks. If you are keeping the birds in a restrained run, make sure it's also covered.

These have worked for me against raccoons and other night predators: https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B01EAFNFJ8/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_dp_T1_FUauzbZVNP87B

Welcome to the wonderful world of chickens!

Pastured Poultry for Profits is where I started with broilers.

As far as I know these birds won't produce very viable offspring unfortunately. There's four breeding steps involved to get the birds to the point where they are now. Not as many steps as a Cornish X but you're not going to get the same type of bird if you can actually get them to mate naturally. I'd just prepare to slaughter them all around 50-55 days old. I read here that others have gone as far as 12-13 weeks but I'll tell you the cockerels are huge at that point, have really big gonads and honestly don't taste as good as they do if they are slaughtered under 8 weeks of age. I sometimes will allow the hens another week depending on their size. 4.5-6 pound dressed birds is what I like. They fit into Vacmaster 8x12 bags well at that size.
These birds may be too big and cumbersome to actually help protect the hens. Well, I guess they'd really just be a sacrificial lamb.

As far as a fair price. I'd say $10 would be fair but most people I know can't even give away their extra roosters. I've got two that were dumped off at my local feed store. I took them in thinking I could re-home them but no luck so far. I'll most likely cull them in the next few days. I have the first batch of Red Rangers coming the second week of April and I need to clean the area in the barn where the rooster currently are to make space for the brooders.

Do you have any photos of these Red Ranger you could share with me?

I agree with the others that the ramp is too steep. Also, is that wood treated? If not, be sure to add on the additional cost of treating. Technically the square footage of that coop/run will be fine for 3 birds. But if you won't be free ranging them, consider a chicken tractor. You get the benefit of a small coop/run while they get the benefit of new ground.

Because I just commented on another thread regarding this coop, I'll share it with you as well - TRIXIE Pet Products Chicken Coop with a View by TRIXIE Pet Products http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00859JJAU/ref=cm_sw_r_udp_awd_UB.stb1R28PGB

As I said in the other thread, this coop needs more secure locks and a skirt to be raccoon proof. You can add a wheel kit like this one
Precision Pet Chicken Coop Retractable Wheel Kit by Precision Pet http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CMFVOZG/ref=cm_sw_r_udp_awd_Unattb0VZ6X17 if you like.

Also, if you're only going to keep 2 or 3 chickens, consider something like this Ware Premium+ Backyard Hutch by Ware http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000HGB93E/ref=cm_sw_r_udp_awd_Coattb01TFZY8. Again, I'd add a skirt and probably replace the latch.

I think chicken tractors are the perfect compromise for low budget, small flocks with limited space. Good luck!

I'd stick with feeding the layer ration or feather fixer as their primary food source, but with the addition of lots of extra "treats" like scratch and wet catfood for the extra protein. If you have a reptile supply shop near you, you might also be able to get some live kingworms, which are FULL of protein and good fats. If live bugs aren't an option, dried mealworms work great as well!

It's best to stick with one brand/type of food as the main food source as the nutrients there are already balanced out in the ratio that the birds need. However, since it's getting colder, there's no harm in helping the birds develop a layer of fat and get them some extra feather-growing proteins.


I think the most important issue here would be to fix the roosting issue immediately, as unless it's fixed they'd just rip the new growth off. Also, for the ladies with the bare backs, chicken saddles might help keep the damage to a minimum. Also, if there is any blood, your local feed store probably carries blue-tinted wound dressing like this one! The blue tint would make the raw featherless butt area less appealing to peck at.

I've killed hundreds of chickens using this method:

1. Get a pair of very sharp garden shears like these. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HP8Z5J6?psc=1 the longer the blades the better, possibly 2" and they must be very sharp and in great shape.
   
   
2. Wrap the chicken in an old towel with the head sticking out. Stand up, and bend over, and hold the chicken between your ankles gently, and hold the head in your hand covering the eyes and beak, and stretch out the neck.
   
   
3. Place the shears around the neck 2 1/2" behind the base of the head, and get as much of the neck in the shears as possible.
   
   
4. Say: "Thanks for being a good chicken, and thanks for the food you've provided for our family, we really appreciated having you with us.".
   
   
5. Give one big SNIP and then if that doesn't do it, snip the remainder, then place the head on the ground on a rag.
   
   
6. The body will convulse and blood will be dispersed, which is why I prefer to use an upside down cone to hold the birds instead of in my hands, but if you don't have a cone, just do your best and the towel will greatly reduce flapping.
   
   
7. The head's eyes will close in 3 or 4 seconds and it's all done peacefully, and humanely, and it's over so quickly for the head and brain, that I feel it's the most humane way I can end a chickens' productive life.

My chickens are 7 weeks old, so take this with a grain of salt; they don't lay eggs yet.

First, you should figure out where your mom's storing her eggs; the refrigerator is not required for eggs from your chickens under many circumstances. I have a cupboard that's probably going to end up having "the egg shelf" with something like that, and it's only tall enough for a single layer, so no stacking for me.

Most importantly, and this is a problem I have yet to solve, is how to make sure you're eating the oldest eggs so they don't go bad, without having to rearrange your whole egg-storage system every single day. This is how you end up with things like the egg skelter (put eggs in the top, take eggs out of the bottom: always eating the oldest eggs).

So, maybe the solution is an egg skelter. If she is storing them in the fridge, I would say probably not (they aren't very space-efficient). But if you can solve the "egg rotation problem", that would probably make her pretty happy.

Edit: I picked the first Google result for an egg skelter and didn't look at the price; there are cheaper egg skelters out there.

My time to shine!! I am a shopaholic and have been scouring for chicken products all season. Personally I think if the holidays as a time to buy things for people that they normally wouldn't buy for themselves. Here's some Recs:

• Sur La Table has a Jacque Pepin line of serving ware that is all chickens, ranging from paper napkins to casserole dishes.
  
• TOMS will be releasing chicken patterned shoes in prep for the year of the cock, but it's catalogue only (I saw it at my parents and then found out that it's not available online :( they are the usual grey slip-one with red rooster prints!)
  
• lots of rooster stuff art will be available in the coming weeks! I'm getting ready to release my greeting cards for New Years, and a lot of other [amazing](https://www.etsy.com/listing/477169816/holiday-greeting-card-year-of-the
  https://www.etsy.com) [artists](https://www.etsy.com/listing/485280797/funny-new-years-card-rooster-party
  https://www.etsy.com) on [Etsy](https://www.etsy.com/listing/475237351/year-of-the-rooster-note-cards-set-of-8
  https://www.etsy.com) are too
  
• did I mention the bajillion chicken plushies that are available on amazon, like puffy the silkie by Adore? I bet she'd want a legion of these on her sofa!
  
• last but not least, I got these chicken boots for going to the coop. They're super comfy.
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Kalesalad, out! MIC DROP

you could get an automatic coop door:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00TONTHRG/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

We have a coop run that is highly secured, and a main coop that is also secured. We close the coop run manually, and the main coop house closes automatically. All it took was closing the girls in the main coop run then letting themselves get locked out overnight a few times for them to learn to get in the house. Now we have gone down after dark more than once and all the girls are in the house and the door closed.

you would need to secure the main run area better to use our approach though. Our run is enclosed on all sides (including bottom) with 1/2" hardware cloth. Right next to the main house door (where the girls tend to sit if they get locked out) is #8 mesh. All mesh is secured between pieces of cedar framing with screws running through the cedar and the mesh.

We use the slide type doors which I feel are more secure than other options. one I made myself with diamond plate aluminum (if you can get flat aluminum I recommend it) that slides between rails of flat bar aluminum that have a gap created by washers. You can also buy a very similar design if you want to:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B018KIVUC0/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1


The biggest thing you need to do to secure your coop/run area is enclose the entire thing in hardware cloth. It needs to be the small 1/2" hardware cloth like here: https://www.amazon.com/Hardware-Galvanized-Chicken-Supports-Poultry/dp/B015PD9F52/ref=sr_1_1?s=lawn-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1499439834&sr=1-1-spons&keywords=hardware+cloth&psc=1.

When I say enclose, I mean fully enclose on all sides including top and bottom. The cloth must be screwed/anchored in place (not just stapled). If you use larger cloth then animals such as racoons can reach through and grab the chickens. You should include the house in the enclosure. If you do not secure the bottom then they will just dig under and in.

I've had animals try and fail to get into my coop. I came out one day to find blood all over one side of the coop where an animal had tried to scratch its way in and lost claws. I also have come out to find that animals had tried to dig under the coop only to find hardware cloth there as well. you MAY be able to get away with just putting a hardware cloth skirt a few feet out from the coop but I prefer to just have the floor be hardware cloth.

Finally, all latches that allow us to get into the coop are safety latches since racoons can figure out normal latches. we mostly use hook and eyes like these (I use stainless though): https://www.amazon.com/Zinc-Plated-Wire-Safety-4-Pack/dp/B01LYNKFIL/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1499440049&sr=1-1&keywords=hook+and+eye+safety+latch

Though our main coop door does have this sort of latch (which we intend to add a padlock to if there are signs of animals getting in through it): https://www.amazon.com/Stanley-National-Hardware-CD1271-Sliding/dp/B009YNW3QS/ref=sr_1_12?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1499440093&sr=1-12&keywords=gate+latch+lock

I personally like Barred Rocks better than any other heritage layer, but I wouldn't say they're exactly flashy. Really, to me, hens aren't that flashy in general. Flash is the rooster's realm of expertise. Might try grabbing a Silkie or a Polish if you want something more exotic, but they aren't the greatest layers in the world. If you're doing an urban flock and you want something docile that lays well, get a production breed (don't know any off the top of my head; anyone want to chime in on good production breeds?). I free range, so I like heritage breeds which are better at fending for themselves and running from predators.

To me, THE definitive resource to look at is The Small Scale Poultry Flock by Harvey Ussery.

Yes! This is the type of setup I was thinking would be good. Something that would just take the chill off and keep the water from freezing.
Thanks for the info!


>I took a birdbath heater and put it under their metal water dispenser in the coop. On the cord that feeds it I put a thermostat-controlled plug that only gives the heater power below 40 degrees or so. That should keep the coop a little warmer and keeps the water from freezing.

>Birdbath heater: http://www.amazon.com/Farm-Innovators-B-9-Economical-Birdbath/dp/B000793M68

>Thermostat plug: http://www.amazon.com/Farm-Innovators-TC-3-Thermostatically-Controlled/dp/B0006U2HD2/ref=pd_bxgy_lg_img_z

I use this. it stretched to waaaay more than those dimesions. i have two spread over my two runs that i rotate when they get muddy, about 1800 square feet. bigger than my house lol.

​

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B011O3480O/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I took a birdbath heater and put it under their metal water dispenser in the coop. On the cord that feeds it I put a thermostat-controlled plug that only gives the heater power below 40 degrees or so. That should keep the coop a little warmer and keeps the water from freezing.

Birdbath heater: http://www.amazon.com/Farm-Innovators-B-9-Economical-Birdbath/dp/B000793M68

Thermostat plug: http://www.amazon.com/Farm-Innovators-TC-3-Thermostatically-Controlled/dp/B0006U2HD2/ref=pd_bxgy_lg_img_z