(Part 2) Best products from r/livesound

Attempting to build a system that will allow us to have in ear monitors for when we go live, as well as in our "studio", however I'm not sure if this will work together or not and I don't want to invest in something that won't work, or is garbage.

Can someone let me know if this will do what I expect, and won't suck? :)

Currently I have a 4 channel mixer plugged into some PA speakers and a Scarlett 2i2 to plug things into my PC.

What that really means is, I have two mics plugged into the PA speakers as well as going to the Scarlett with the rest of everything going through amps and just the drums themselves.

We are a 4 piece band with drums, guitar, bass, and vocals.

Currently with our setup, we can record everything through a mic I have setup in the practice space but it's less than ideal to set levels and actually have any sort of decent sound.

If we want to record things separately then I can just plug whatever we want to record (aside from drums) into the Scarlett and call it good.

However we'd like to have everything go through a central source, and be able to hear that central source play back to us through some IEMs while we play. We would also all like to have our own mixes, and have the mixes be stereo

I'd love suggestions/feedback on my proposed setup and would like to know if what I'm thinking of would even be feasible.

The proposed setup - Cables aren't necessarily a specific brand but the length/type:

1x Behringer XR18 Mixer

1x P16-M

4x Galaxy Audio AS-1100

1x Pyle Pro Drum Mic Kit or some other simple drum mic kit

1x Kick Drum Mic Stand

2x Overhead Mic Stand

6x Short(ish) XLR Cables

2x XLR to 1/4 Cables

How I'm seeing everything plug together is:
Into XR18

• Vocal mics
  
• Guitar amp output
  
• Bass amp output
  
• Drum mic kit
  
  Out of XR18
  
  
• Channels 1-2 -> Galaxy Audio
  
• Channels 3-4 -> Galaxy Audio
  
• Channels 5-6 -> Galaxy Audio
  
• Main L/R -> PA Speakers
  
• Ethernet Port -> P16-M -> Galaxy Audio
  
• USB Port -> PC -> Recording
  
  To me this seems like it SHOULD all work, but I'd like some other opinions on if it will work as I expect or not, or if I need/don't need components.
  
  Is anyone able to see anything that just looks inherintely BAD with the list of components I'm wanting to get? I know the wireless systems aren't great, but we don't want to spend a ton of money (at least right now) on some quality systems.
  
  For now this will all be free-standing but eventually I hope to build a case to house everything. Will all of the above be able to fit inside a case, or will I face any issues?
  
  What are some good cable brands I should go for or avoid?

For a resource the Live Sound Operator's Handbook is worth a read. It won't get you the experience you need but it will lay a pretty decent foundation and you can read it while you're looking for live sound work.

Everyone I know personally who mixes for bands, including myself, started by doing grunt labor for little to no money, proved they were useful and started getting asked to go to gigs, hauled lots of boxes, wound lots of cable, and did more grunt work. Then got to mix monitors. Then eventually FOH. As word gets around town that you mix well and are reliable more jobs come your way and off you go.

Volunteer, get yourself a small PA, help a friend, whatever just find a way to start mixing bands. Jump at any chance to work with a good engineer and go from there. And don't quit your day job. :)

Hi, system tech here, bit of a pet topic for me.

• As bustedmustard (ha!) mentioned, Bob McCarthy's book is hands down the best and most complete resource for this. Bob has probably done more to advance the state of knowledge of this field more than anyone else alive so definitely start there. This is truly the system tech bible. Definitely get the 3rd edition though, as it has been completely rewritten and contains a lot more new stuff. It's not like a math text where they just rearrange the graphics and print a new one. As the knowledge develops, so does Bob's book.
  
• Merlijn Van Veen was a major influence on Bob's 3rd edition, and is probably the #2 guy in the world in optimization after Bob. Read his website and sign up for his newsletter. He has a lot of current research going on in the area of directional sub arrays and measurement techniques. His stuff frequently pops up in Live Sound International and on ProSoundWeb, so keep an eye out there as well. He's got a great article on understanding Impulse Response coming out in the October issue. He recently got hired by Meyer Sound, who are on the forefront of developing array theory, so I expect to see even greater things from him.
  
• Can't ignore the great Howard Page. He's notable for being one of the guys who tunes his PA perfectly flat, as opposed to a bit of a tilt to match the spectrum of music. I wouldn't say it's a debate but it is a bit of a matter of opinion. He's a great LSI Roundtable asking a bunch of guys about tilting / sub bump.
  
• Lastly I'm willing to answer any questions you have...array theory is not something I often get to talk about with people who actually want to hear it :D Glad you're interested. I'm considering putting together some sort of webinar on it. That's about as far as I've gotten with the idea.
  
  ​

1. Okay! I actually already have one of those products for output of the sound to the players through the gamepad of the Wii U (it has an aux out on it I send to the headphone amp to then send to two different speakers with optional headsets hooked up to the speaker). Looks like I should pick up one more!
   
   
2. With the alternative option, would a Focus Scarlett 2i2 be able to produce what you said? I already own it as it has been my setup for the past year. I literally might have to draw a diagram of what you said to confirm I understand what you wrote out by the way. haha. (I'd just plug the USB in to the computer for simply power I'd assume).
   
   
3. Thanks! I will definitely just continue to be curious and look into everything I can!
   
   I guess this is my last two questions (for now).
   
   What USB Mixer do you recommend at my price point ($300 with tax max)? So far the two options I've looked at were the Mackie I listed before and then the Behringer Xenyx X2222USB. I actually am leaning towards the Behringer right now since it has an Earth Loop function (I've had troubles with that on my Focusrite sometimes) and it seems to have more options with outputs and such. If you have any other suggestions for another USB Mixer, what I should be looking for, and just general assesments and recommendations I'd definitely love to hear it. If I have any further questions that come up later, can I DM you?

I see what you're talking about. I'm not so concerned about noise as I am about doing this in a weird/hacky roundabout way.

Why stereo? I get that it's nice, but you're going to double the number of buses used per channel, which seems pretty wasteful.
Or to put it another way, it makes more sense to have 16 completely separate monitor channels than it does to have 8 stereo channels and probably end up sharing them. The logic being, if you're running a large enough event to require 8 monitors, you'll probably eventually need more monitors or buses. It can be a major pain to re-route everything to make it work.


If you do somehow have 16 buses to spare, run them all into passive DI boxes via a gender changer adapter or cable (https://btpa.com/MIC3-XX.html for custom length female to female xlr) and use a TS 1/4in to 1/4 TRS (aka insert cable) to get your individual mixes. This usually works for passive DI boxes, almost never works with active boxes. You'll be buying 16 DI boxes (and probably a couple spares), 16 female to female XLR cables (and probably a couple spares) and 8 insert cables (aka 1/4in unbal to TRS, probably at least 1 spare).

Or, the other route is to use the Shure a85f in-line inpedance matcher (or similar) to get your XLR channels to 1/4in TS https://www.amazon.com/Shure-A85F-Transformer-Female-4-Inch/dp/B0006NMUHW, then use a Y adapter to get to TRS https://www.amazon.com/Hosa-YPP-117-Stereo-Breakout-Cable/dp/B000068O54
I didn't bother to spec anything nicer than Hosa cabling here, you probably should look into something nicer if this is the route you take.

**


You can also try not using the DI boxes and losing the impedance matching. Sometimes this works, sometimes it doesn't. Hard to tell on paper if you'll get away with it. I'd personally try one channel worth this way and if it works roll it out to the rest. It's a much simpler, single cable setup (although technically "wrong"). BTPA.com and others will make you custom cabling, and if your order is pretty large they'll work with you on price if you ask.

A good cable tester is a godsend for making and repairing cables, especially for a beginner. But Is it safe to solder into a connector plugged into a cable tester like that? I've always been afraid that the hot pins would fry the tester. I'm a big fan of securing the connector in a small table vice [like this](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0057PUR88/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_zZs-ub1KG1ZJ9
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0057PUR88/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_zZs-ub1KG1ZJ9)

Oh and clear heat shrink over Dymo Rhino labels is absolutely the way to go for labeling. Buy a spool of heat shrink off Amazon, it's waaaaay overpriced if you get the small bags of it in a store.

First, i would like to preface by saying I pack a peli mostly for local gigs and not touring but from people I've talked to there are definitely similarities in what you would bring. I generally pack different pieces of gear depending on what the gig is but the stuff that stays the same is what follows (In no particular order):

SM58 (For testing or as a spare)

SM57 (not having this is like being a contractor and not bringing a drill)

ProAV2 (Swiss army knife of DIs)

Headphones (I usually pack cans and in ears)

Headphone extension cable

SPL Meter

RF Explorer

Small audio recorder (If you wanna capture mixes or if a client asks for a specific recording of something)

2 short, high-quality xlrs (for testing or to use with the AV2 or USB-P)

Peavey USB-P

Cable tester

Sender/Sniffer

Sharpies

Pens

Board tape

Skin tape/Medical tape (to secure lavs, or the occasional In ear cable)

All the adapters (As many as you can get your hands on, Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it)

Extra AAs (Procells always, just in case)

Various mic clips (Just in case you need a specific one or one breaks)

Flashlight

Headlamp

Precision screwdriver set

Leatherman

Wire cutters

Wire strippers

Ipad

Usb power bank

Various cables and adapters for computers and apple products


I'm Probably leaving out alot but thats typically what I take on most shows.

1. I would find a way to split the headphone jack that's built into the console, Esports groups I've worked with before used those headsets and one of these Behringer headphone amps for this. So out of headphone port, into headphone amp, out of headphone amp to up to 4 headsets.
   
   
2. This gets more complex and isn't REALLY possible with this mixer or without another mixer in addition. You would want a mixer with another Aux send and basically set up another mix minus that would include you and everything else the casters want to hear (themselves, game audio) and route that through an aux and then that aux out to the caster headphones. Alternatively you could get a second small mixer and take the headphone out of your larger mixer, put that into the small mixer, add your God headset into that small mixer and then out of that small mixer into the caster headphones. Be aware that if you care a lot for Stereo (hearing imaging or two different things in either ear) interconnects get a lot more complicated.
   
   
3. I'm sure there are a billion things out there, I learned nearly everything on the job or through my college degree so it's hard to call up any one resource that would cover all the basics. My first suggestion would be read the manual for whatever console you're interested in purchasing and google any terms that you aren't familiar with, generally basic analog console manuals are great at explaining functionality and industry terms. The Mackie 1604 was bog standard for many years as the cheap analog mixer so I'd say click on through that to get a core understanding.

I have the Tascam DR-05 and a Zoom H1N. I also have a Tascam DR60D for DSLR audio shoots. I used them in lots of different location recording aspects for video production.

I really like the Zoom H1N. For the kind of thing you are talking about, I prefer it over the Tascam. I don't know if it is the mic positioning or just the mic elements themselves, the Zoom seems to just sound better to me for quick audio grabs. They have a nice little "Cat" to go over the mics for outside recording and I found it really helps to eliminate any wind noise.

I think this kit with the shockmount kit, would do good to get you started on your project:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07B4KFQW7

Behringer UCA202: https://www.amazon.com/BEHRINGER-U-Control-Low-Latency-Interface-Digital/dp/B000KW2YEI/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1541475191&sr=8-3&keywords=behringer+usb+soundcard

It's nothing special, but it's a cheap and easy 2 in/2 out RCA interface. I've had one floating around for various little tasks for like six years, it's been super reliable and it's literally $30.

Not quite sure how large of an area you need to cover, nor how loud you need it to be, but... I would recommend:

Westinghouse 2200-watt inverter generator

https://www.amazon.com/Westinghouse-iGen2200-Portable-Inverter-Generator/dp/B01MUP6L1U

This is really a bit of overkill, but it's the smallest, quietest portable generator that you can get that will be reliable and rock solid. The bonus: you could use it to power a crockpot, some lighting, fans, etc., at your tailgate.

​

For speakers, any old powered speaker will work.

On the cheap: Behringer EuroLive

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002C4QWXQ/ref=psdc_11975001_t1_B001XWD3LC

Or, a lot nicer: Yamaha DBR12

https://www.amazon.com/Yamaha-DBR-Powered-Speaker-Cabinet/dp/B00NIS8IZ0

​

Don't forget to purchase some stands!

​

Either of those speakers will consume around 120-watts each at full-tilt-boogie-annoyingly-loud levels. So, you'll have tons of extra power available with that generator.

That would do the job but it’s honestly a little lacking for that price range.

I’d honestly recommend this one

Little bit more money, but waaaay more features. It’ll also have pre/post fader switches which will be instrumental in the setup you’re talking about.

If you are trying to comply with different noise regulations, they should be able to tell you whether they use A/B/C. If they don't tell you what methods they are using to enforce their regulations, that means they don't know what they are talking about and they will just shut you down if they feel like it. Their regulations should say something like 100dBA as measured from the property line, or 108dBC as measured from 10 feet from exhaust. If they say something like "cannot exceed 85dB" thats such a vague regulation that it basically just means you're getting shut down if there is a complaint.

​

There are companies that sell and calibrate expensive dB meters, but it sounds like you just need to ballpark it.

​

https://www.amazon.com/VLIKE-Digital-Measurement-Frequency-Weighting/dp/B071J17TKL/ref=sr_1_8?keywords=dB+meter&qid=1554306569&s=gateway&sr=8-8

​

something like that will be fine for your purposes. If you measure inside your garage, it will read much louder than if you measure outside, so take that in to consideration

I work for a "living out their glory days" national act and I use these on all my mic stands including for my wireless paddle. Been using them for 6 months or so and they've held up pretty well. https://www.amazon.com/Stage-QK2B-Microphone-Quick-Release/dp/B0007SL86A/

First, the most important thing is mic placement. Get those mics up and over the choir, angle them down, and follow the 3:1 rule.

As far as what micc to use, the Behringer C-2 are a great mic for the money. They come as a matched pair for only $60. I encourage you to watch the video and read the reviews before dismissing them based on name or price. I've used them on choirs, drums, guitars, and just about everything else and they always do a great job. They come with basic windscreens, but you can put some dead cats on them if you're in a really windy environment.

Howdy partner.

In addition to the Balanced vs Unbalanced issue, the other issue is impedance. Pedals are designed for High Z inputs. You would need a device like this: Shure A85F Transformer; Low Z, Female XLR to High Z 1/4-Inch Phone Plug https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006NMUHW/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_UJTtDbTBKTBW2

This would make sure you have a good damping factor which in turn will give you good signal.

Hmm this is tricky, this is how I would do it based on what you provide.

• Take the audio out from the game sound PC by using the headphone output and using this kind of cable. Another cleaner path is using a USB audio interface like a Peavey USB-P. I would plug in to channels 11/12. If you're using something like a Peavey USB-P, you'll need to use two XLR cables and two mic channels on the mixer, be sure to pan hard LR when you use this route.
  
  
• You'll need a headphone amp that can provide more than one output, similar to something like a Behringer AMP800. Once you get that, plug in to the mixer via PHONES using this cable.
  
  
• Plug in the headset mic inputs to mic channels 1 & 2. If you know how to use the compressor, insert using this cable.
  
  
• Output the mixer via USB to your twitch streaming PC, set the mic to the mackie USB option.
  
  Am I missing anything?

Yes, the XLR and 1/4" are wired in parallel, and both active at the same time. If you need to split, you'd need [two of] something like this.

these are by far the best cable ties for the money.

Ninja Edit: Just noticed you are in the UK, I'm sure amazonUK has these also!

i've used tape in the past, but the inevitable stickiness has led me to find a different solution.

Colored Zip ties on the xlr connectors is what I came up with. it could go on the cable itself too, but this way I can still easily unscrew the connector to check or fix the solder joints.

Each length has its own color and goes into a matching $10 backpack before its thrown into the road case. https://www.amazon.com/Everest-Luggage-Basic-Backpack-Medium/dp/B005IFBYB6/

I'd probably skip the backpacks if I was dealing with more cables, but for the size of events I work, this is perfect.

Why not just get some xlr y adaptors for the time being and run that way. Then what you do for the podcast doesn't matter what you do live.

Hosa YXM-121 XLR3F to Dual XLR3M Y Cable, 6 inch https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000068O59/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_hpRLBb78XPTAP

Run the podcast setup like normal. Take the other set of sends and plug them into a sound board. Have the laptop plugged into the sound board for whatever tracks you need to play back live as well? I guess I'm not familiar enough with your saw stuff if you can just send the tracks and not the mics with the way you have it set up.

I use these: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0007SL86A?refRID=Y9RMQT108TNZDYTAG7JE&ref_=pd_ys_c_rfy_rp_3

Love them.

You may consider buying this also to use with you app. It's a calibrated mic for your phone / tablet. It's is alot more accurate and pretty affordable .

http://www.amazon.com/Dayton-Audio-iMM-6-Calibrated-Measurement/dp/B00ADR2B84/ref=sr_1_fkmr1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1457636624&sr=8-1-fkmr1&keywords=Pike+audio+rta+mic

Also check out this mic to use with AudioTools. Works surprisingly well.

I like to use the Velcro brand cable ties.

http://www.amazon.com/Velcro-Reusable-Self-Gripping-Inches-91140/dp/B001E1Y5O6

You can get them at Amazon, Home Depot, Wal-Mart (I think?).

to go along with the aps suggested by others ITT, I have this Dayton Audio iMM-6 Calibrated Measurement Microphone for iPhone, iPad Tablet and Android on my amazon wish list to buy in the near future for this sort of use.

( yo $20)

Does anybody have anything good or bad to say about this mic?

A distribution amp is definitely the way to go - if you want to stay economical, you probably need something like this.

Links to gear posted above:

Behringer X18 Air rack mount mixer: http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/XR18

Drum mics: http://www.amazon.com/Pyle-Pro-PDKM7-Microphone-Mounting-Accesories/dp/B003FW0IHA

GLS Audio Mics (I also recommend their XLR cables): http://www.speakerrepair.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=genem&Category_Code=microphones

EV powered speakers: http://www.zzounds.com/item--ELVELX112?siid=99167&gclid=CIHX2a-XqMQCFdccgQoda5EAxw

Mic stands: http://www.musiciansfriend.com/accessories/on-stage-stands-mic-stand-package

Hmm... Headphone amplifier maybe?

http://amzn.com/B000KIPT30 (or something like this)?

sound reenforcement handbook for fundamentals

https://www.amazon.com/Sound-Reinforcement-Handbook-Gary-Davis/dp/0881889008/ref=pd_bxgy_14_img_3?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=0881889008&pd_rd_r=CCG9CPVAPDH3ECTFGHMA&pd_rd_w=C5R8y&pd_rd_wg=5hRnU&psc=1&refRID=CCG9CPVAPDH3ECTFGHMA

system set up and optimization

https://www.amazon.com/Sound-Systems-Optimization-Techniques-Alignment/dp/0415731011/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1496423594&sr=8-1&keywords=sound+system+design+and+optimization

deeper fundamentals and underlying theory behind systems,

https://www.amazon.com/Sound-System-Engineering-Don-Davis/dp/0240818466/ref=pd_sim_14_10?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=0240818466&pd_rd_r=HSPA70XSS4QNR9DZF1P5&pd_rd_w=5ywPt&pd_rd_wg=X1Td5&psc=1&refRID=HSPA70XSS4QNR9DZF1P5

approachable fundamentals, but not too much deeper theory - kind of a up and running style of book

https://www.amazon.com/Ultimate-Operators-Handbook-Guides-online/dp/1617805599/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

I've been using these for years.

https://www.amazon.com/VELCRO-Brand-Black-2-Inch-91140/dp/B001E1Y5O6

They've served me well, and are easy to work with. I've used cords, other straps, dealt with venues that tie the XLR to itself(shudder), etc.
I use the orange cable reels for the majority of my cables now, but still use these straps with what doesn't go on the reels.

Does anyone know anything about this lil cellphone measurement mic?

~20 on amazon

http://www.amazon.com/Dayton-Audio-iMM-6-Calibrated-Measurement/dp/B00ADR2B84/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1415331504&sr=8-2&keywords=measurement+microphone

Alternatively, for less than the cost of a stereo DI, you could just add a second output interface. I have this one and it's fine: Peavey USB Audio Interface https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004A4PSEU/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_QMgfzbMA9GX3R

https://www.amazon.com.au/Stage-QK2B-Microphone-Quick-Release/dp/B0007SL86A

BOOSH

http://www.amazon.com/Peavey-USBP-USB-Audio-Interface/dp/B004A4PSEU

This works

AT2021 - 79$: https://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-AT2021-Cardioid-Condenser-Microphone/dp/B005OCZOA0/ref=sr_1_1?s=musical-instruments&ie=UTF8&qid=1538709519&sr=1-1&keywords=at2021

​

Behringer C2's - 69$ for a PAIR of 2: https://www.amazon.com/Behringer-C-2-BEHRINGER/dp/B000CZ0RLU/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

​

Samson C02's - 99$ for a PAIR of 2: https://www.amazon.com/Samson-C02-Pencil-Condenser-Microphones/dp/B0002D0KBE/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8