(Part 2) Best products from r/pagan

> 1.) How are the gods viewed? Extra-dimensional beings, intelligences of natural forces or something else? Are they part of our world or another one?

These small questions demand exhaustive responses, haha. It's difficult for me to condense it here, but I will try, and will more than likely end up elaborating in comments later on.

The Netjeru are viewed as Gods -- Gods with multifarious and complex natures. They're not archetypes. They're not mere "metaphors" for anything, and are by no means facile explanations for natural phenomena conconcted by "pre-rational" humans, as many Moderns who privilege promissory materialist philosophy and interpretations are so fond of and known to say.

Personification-deities -- like Ma'at, the embodiment of the concept of ma'at; Sia, the embodiment of Divine intellect, perception, prophecy, etc.; and Shai(t), the God Who manifests more often as male than as female, and embodies fate, destiny, prophecy, etc. -- are still literal Divine beings as all the rest, but are not ones which are personable and personally accessible to human beings, on human terms. Some are much more "humanly accessible" than others. There are many classes of deities, with many roles and functions each performs, both on an individual basis and as units.

Fair warning: One does not get very far with two-dimensional interpretations and approaches to Egyptian religion(s). Ancient Egyptian theo-logic is incredibly polyvalent, and is not comprised of nor dictated by a series of competitive and contradictory bivalent values.

Arguably, the majority of the Netjeru are both immanent (within the world) and transcendent (above/outside the material world but still affecting it). That said, there are Gods that specifically dwell in the Duat (the Unseen), and do not manifest in the Seen (the material world which we inhabit). These obscure legions of specialized Divinities and "demons" are primarily but not exclusively encountered in funerary religious material, including but not limited to the Books of the Earth.

We must account for differences between localities and time periods, too . . . there is simply no simple, short, sweet answer (or set(s) of answers) to such questions, I'm afraid. Nor should there be, for a religion (or rather, series of religions) so old and multiplex as those of Ancient Egypt.

>2.) What should I read first? Should I study the myths or read a 101 book?

>3.) What specific books do you recommend?

There is no one book, nor only a couple of "handy manuals," that will inform you even remotely satisfactorily on Ancient Egyptian religion(s) and/or ritual mechanics. Anything that focuses solely on "myth," as per the nature of the discipline of "Mythology" (which is the study of myth as literature, frequently to the exclusion of cultural and religious context, and without regard for the fact that not all myth corresponds to ritual, or vice versa), will inevitably be inadequate and piecemeal.

The easiest place for me to start is to advise you whose works to avoid. Rosemary Clark, E. A. Wallis Budge, Judith Page, Normandi Ellis, Jeremy Naydler, and Jocelyn Almond are among those on the "Do Not Read" list. They're all rife with interpretative and methodological faux pas and plain-old factual historical inaccuracies.

The not-so-easy place for me to go from there is whose I recommend. There are too many scholars and texts to recommend, and my advice and recommendations are most definitely colored by my formal education in Philo/Theo and Ancient Near Eastern Studies. There are some articles I would recommend before out-and-out textbooks, but I realize that not many people have ready access to them as I do.

Anyway, even the best "Western" scholars, such a Jan Assmann and John Baines and Dimitri Meeks and Stephen Quirke, have their own interpretative problems embedded in their best pieces of writing. That said, Stephen Quirke probably has the best (not to mention the most recent) introductory, survey text on Ancient Egyptian religion(s) to date. I absolutely do not recommend Garry Shaw's, which was published last year, for all his privileging of Modernity over "pre-rational" Ancient non-Greeks and refusal to view Egyptian religious material as anything other than "poor explanations of the physical world for people without recourse to particle physics" (paraphrasing, though "for people without recourse to particle physics" are among his exact words). Nor does Shaw say anything different or better than other scholars like Meeks and Assmann and Baines have already said years earlier, elsewhere.

Erik Hornung's Conceptions of God in Ancient Egypt : The One and the Many is one of the most important books on the nature of Egyptian religion(s). While I have some issues with it, I highly advise people curious about Egyptian religion(s) read that text in particular. Definitely plan to read that one, and read it slowly and carefully. Many Modern Kemetics who have read it didn't particularly understand the material for whatever reasons, which I highly suspect had to do with, in no small part, speed-reading and no time taken for critical reflection.

Maulana Karenga composed the most extensive -- not to mention, fair -- study on the Egyptian concept of ma'at to date. He does a good job of pointing out some problems in other scholars' attempts at unpacking the issue over the last several decades, and he does a good job outlining what, precisely, ma'at entails morally-ethically through extensive analyses of diverse bodies of textual evidence from different periods of Pharaonic history. Ma'at, in case you and/or those reading don't already know, is the underpinning of the entire religion(s) and Kemetic worldview, and it's impossible to be a Kemetic without understanding what ma'at is, and making it the foremost part of one's daily life and the foremost goal of one's life.

Robert K. Ritner and Geraldine Pinch wrote texts addressing heka -- Ritner's are considered to be among the best, while Pinch's are considered adequate (she makes glaring citation mistakes in areas, for instance, i.e. in the sections she writes concerning the Seven Hathors. No spell in primary source material, from any period, exists where They perform as Pinch states They perform, on top of her not providing citation for what text she (mis)interpreted those sections from). J. F. Borghouts' Ancient Egyptian Magical Texts, although brief, is frequently cited and worth looking at. A PDF of it should be floating around the interwebs somewhere, if you're interested in that, since it's pretty expensive to acquire physical copies of and is, to my knowledge, since out of print.

James P. Allen's, Thomas G. Allen's, and Raymond O. Faulkner's translations of the most famous funerary texts are among the best. Adriaan De Buck's translations of the Coffin Texts are considered authoritative, but are considerably difficult -- especially for those outside Academia -- to gain access to. I should note that the funerary texts are only so important. They honestly do not play a major role in Modern Kemetic practice and belief, though Modern Kemetics do by no means totally ignore them. Important to know, not much practical use, in other words.

As for Modern Kemetic works . . . nnnnot many exist which I could recommend in good conscience. The late Richard Reidy's Eternal Egypt is much acclaimed by many Modern Kemetics, though it does contain some errors. That's not to say that it's utterly useless, only that some of the rituals contained therein (such as those pertaining to Sekhmet) are predicated on erroneous information and mistaken interpretations. Tamara Siuda's Ancient Egyptian Prayerbook is, admittedly, only particularly handy if you're looking into becoming part of the Kemetic Orthodox Temple. It contains pointers on how to erect and dedicate shrines (in the Kemetic Orthodox way, that is); how to perform the Kemetic Orthodox rite of senut; "how to pray" and prayers in English; and snippets of introductory information about some of the most important Egyptian deities. Nothing super-heavy.

I hope this helps; and apologies for the length of my response.

> Is this really offensive? If it is, please explain it to me. It's not enough to tell me it is, I've got to know why.

For some it will be, for others not so much.

If you asked me if you could approach paganism, but dropping the "supernatural" stuff from it, I'd say "Hell yeah!" because I do just that. I don't really have much use for divination or crystals or anything like that, so I just don't use them in my practice. I can see why some would use it and I understand how some use them practically, but I just don't feel the need for it.

For me, Paganism is really about the Natural world. The Earth is my Mother (My goddess, if you might like to say so), and the Sun is my Father (My god, if you will). I know a lot of other pagans do this do, but not all. Some pagans use pantheons for deity, but deity is not a necessity in paganism.

I still like ritual, though I don't do much pagan ritual in my personal practice, because the symbols used in it represent natural forces and things going on in the world. A "supernatural non-believer" could find use and spiritual meaning in ritual (as well as gods and crystals and magic), because to me (and surely others out there) they're just symbols, but symbols have a lot of personal power. They can help you change your mindset, help you understand things better.

Some will find calling things "supernatural" offensive, because some pagans do believe "supernatural" things exist, and don't view them as "supernatural." This is perfectly okay, to me, it's just not my way of approaching things.

TL;DR It will vary from person to person, and can be a sensitive topic for some. Not for all, though.

As for books without too much of a supernatural inclination about Paganism, I'd try out Ronald Hutton. His Triumph of the Moon is more about the history and roots of paganism, but he's very detailed and descriptive, as well as academic.

Margot Adler's Drawing Down the Moon is of the same vein as Triumph of the Moon. Both are pretty heavy and tome-like, but are filled with invaluable information.

If you're looking into Wicca theology, I found Bryan Lankford's Wicca Demystified to be a great in depth explanation, especially for an "outsider." A lot of the "beginners" books on Wicca you'll find are heavy on ritual and magic, and seeing how you don't have much fondness for it, I think Lankford's book might be better suited for you.

And I haven't read it, but Dana Eiler's Practical Pagan might be of interest to you. It seems to have the less "magicy-supernatural" and more of a mundane, practical approach to paganism. Not sure about it, though. You might find some good info in the amazon's review section of the book.

I feel like there's another book or two that I've read that taps into what you're looking for, but I just can't think of it. There are some cool anthologies full of essays of paganism in the real world, which I find are invaluable for their information, and not so heavy on the "supernatural side," like Pagan Visions for a Sustainable Future and Celebrating the Pagan Soul.

PS

>I'm use to kinda being primed to attack fundamentalism in Christianity and I've got little good to say about Islam at all.

I wouldn't be so dismissive of Christianity and Islam in general. Interfaith can be a very important. You don't have to agree with what they believe, but personally I know a few Muslims who are very kind and generous, and if they give credit to their religion for their kindness and generosity, I wouldn't say there's nothing good to say about Islam. But that's neither here nor there.

So you seem to have found a deity you wish to worship. She has spoken to you twice now. Congratulations, because some people never get that call. Here is some advice I can give you:

• Reach out to other Hellenic Polytheists. Nyx isn't an extremely popular goddess so her worship is limited, but you will find other people who are able to acknowledge and respect your worship of her in the Hellenic Polytheist community. /r/HellenicPolytheism
  
  
• Research, research, research. The more you know about Nyx, the better you will be able to worship her. Here is a website with information about Nyx. Here is her Orphic hymn.
  
  
• Worship her. Say the Orphic hymn nightly before you go to bed. Or write your own. Establish a shrine to her. Celebrate festivals of hers. If you can't find any, create your own. Record your experiences, and when comfortable, share them with others who may be interested.
  
  
• Don't be discouraged when you feel you are alone in your worship. Nyx's worship isn't widespread at the moment, but 50 years ago hardly any of our deities' were. Perhaps she is calling you to help her change that.
  
  Having a shrine would be a great place to pray to her. Unfortunately Nyx doesn't have the mass produced yet easily recognizable bronze resin statues that many other Greek deities have, but perhaps this might work? You could put her on a black or starry piece of fabric from Michaels, and maybe add a humidifier near the space? (She was described as a misty goddess). These are a few shrine ideas, obviously depends on what you want and how much you can afford. And again, simply stargazing outside works too.
  
  For her worship, you may try your hand at writing prayers or use those that already exist. There may be others in the Hellenic Polytheist community who have written modern prayers, or may be willing to write some for free. There are also plenty of 'night' themed candles, incense, and songs you may wish to use in your worship. Best of luck! Feel free to ask any follow up questions.

Not a book, exactly, and the forums are pretty much a ghost town, but Pagan Library has a lot of good articles on it.


I have referenced "The Real Witches' Kitchen" by Kate West quite a bit for "Hearth Magic" type stuff, as it's basically a cookbook with Meaning and Workings added to it. Has stuff like Herbal work, oils and lotions, candles and incenses, feasting around the Wheel of the Year, breads, soups and foods to strengthen and heal, brews and teas, and such.


I've also used "Wheel of the Year: Living the Magical Life" by Pauline Campanelli to learn about the Sabbats and the months.


Not my favorite resource, but one that does have some good information is "Witch Crafting: A Spiritual Guide to Making Magic" by Phyllis Curott, H.Ps.


I've also worked with "Elemental Witch: Fire, Air, Water, Earth; Discover Your Natural Affinity" by Tammy Sullivan. It's a pretty good book, and I'm planning on re-reading it this winter. It helped me understand my two Elements (Water from birth sign, Air from personality) much better, so I've been able to ground and charge better.


And, of course, Scott Cunningham has a good collection of reference books available. Some of them are specific reference books like his Crystals book, some of them are general reference like some of his Wicca books. Much like Silver Ravenwolf, he's a fairly prolific author with people who either love his stuff, hate his stuff, or simply regard them as references...which is where I fall. Not fond of Silver Ravenwolf, myself, though, I only have one of her books, a Halloween themed one.


My best advice would be to see if a local public library can get you copies of any books you're interested in, that way you don't spend the money on things that don't have meaning for you. If, after you've started reading the book, you feel it fits, you can always track down a copy later. That's how I did it, to be honest. Spent many an afternoon and evening in the Carnegie Library of Pittsburgh's Main branch when I was first looking. Even now, when I'm not 100% certain about the usefulness of a book, even for mundane crafts or stuff, I'll get the local branch library to pull a copy.


Hope this helps.

I had to do some thinking, and I have two, because I'm usually bad at picking one of anything.

1) A story I heard about the Orishas Yemaya and Oshun and their travel to Cuba. I found a book on Google and typed up the relevant excerpt:

>Ochun, oricha of the river, love, and all things sweet found out that those who were sent to Cuba were lonely and sad so she decided to go there to dance, comfort, and keep them company. However, she worried about the long voyage from Africa to Cuba.

>Full of apprehension, she went to visit her sister Yemaya, oricha of the sea, and told her, “Yemaya, I have to cross the sea to go to Cuba and be with my children, but I am afraid of the long trip.” Yemaya comforted her, “Don't be afraid, Ochun, I will take care of you. I will take you to the bottom of the ocean and we will cross it without hazards.”

>Appeased, Ochun said “You have reassured me, but tell me Yemaya, you who reach all the way to Cuba and visit its shores and beaches, how is Cuba, and how are the Cubans?” Yemaya told Ochun, “Cuba is very much like Africa. There are many coconut and palm trees, it is never cold, and it has peaceful rivers and long tropical nights. However, all the Cubans are not black as the people here, some are white and others are mulattoes.”

>Ochun, still apprehensive, told Yemaya, I am worried since I am not used to people different from us. I would like you to grant me two wishes. As we make our way to Cuba, I want the waves of the ocean to straighten my hair just a little bit and its foams to lighten my skin just a little. Thus, when I arrive in Cuba I will neither be black nor white. I will be accepted by all Cubans, blacks, whites, and mulattoes. All of them will be my children.”

> With her queenly and maternal demeanor Yemaya granted Ochun her two wishes and this is why Cubans were graced with a mother who resembles them all.

2 ) A story about Ganesha and Kartikeya that I originally read as a retelling in the excellent "The Broken Tusk: Stories of the Hindu God Ganesha" by Uma Krishnaswami (The latter god is called Murugan in Krishnaswami's book, in the link to the story I give, he is called Kartikeya) In the story, Ganesha and Kartikeya fight over a mango and it is suggested that the two gods have a contest to win the mango. (In the linked story, it is the sage Narada who causes all this and suggests the contest, in Krishnaswami's book, Narada is not in it and Shiva, their father, suggested the contest.) Whoever circles the Universe first wins the mango. Kartikeya gets on his peacock and speeds away. Ganesha walks around his parents Shiva and Parvati, because to him, they are the Universe. :) Ganesha wins.

(Edited slightly to add that Ganesha wins the contest.)

Not sure if they have statues, but I love AzureGreen. Since I'm redditing at work I'll make a more complete list when I get home :)

EDIT: I'm home!

I've gotten only 3 statues online so far, so I'm just gonna link you to where I got them. The statues all arrived in a timely manner and in good condition so I have no problem recommending these sellers :) I bought a smaller figurine of Kwan Yin at a local store, and I can't remember where I got my statue of Hotei (fat happy buddha) from.

Here is where I got my first Santa Muerte statue. The second one was bought for me by my mom when she was on vacation in California.

Here is where I got my Goddess statue.

Here is where I got my Buddha statue. The Amazon store that I purchased my altar cloth from is India Shakti.

Not sure if it counts as a statue, but here is where I got my solar-powered prayer wheel :) Mom's got a Hotei next to our front door so I got the prayer wheel for it after I started turning the statue's spot into a mini-altar.

Another store I like is Vodoustore.com. I haven't gotten any statues from there yet, but I've gotten some prayer cards from them--Sta Muerte, Odin, Hekate, and I think one of Papa Legba--and they've arrived in a pretty timely manner. I've got some more cards sitting in my cart on that site. They've got all kinds of stuff so it's definitely worth checking out if that's your thing.

The Wicked Griffin sells awesome jewelry. I got a bracelet from them that I absolutely love. Not statues, I know, but definitely worth checking out!

I hope this helps!

Thanks for this post. We do kind of need a Morrigan thread to end all Morrigan threads.

I think there are problems with the Morrigan's treatment on both ends of the spectrum. On one hand, we have the casual mall goths who find a dark and brutal goddess that seems specially crafted to hit every bullet on their edge cred, stick-it-to-the-man checklist. These people run the risk of approaching a powerful force for the wrong reason and in the wrong way. And they understandably catch flak from the buttoned-up adults in the room.

Then you have people who are so earnest about authenticity and their respect for the Morrigan's power, that they essentially try to scare off her would-be devotees (or, in some cases, just relentlessly mock them). The friends-don't-let-friends-worship-the-Morrigan crowd.

First of all, if the Morrigan actually wants you and you turn away from her, that is literally the textbook way to incur her wrath. Advising someone to ignore what they think might be her calling because you want them to play it safe strikes me as tragically ironic.

My other problem with these folk is that their "respect for her power" is so fearful is that they are effectively demonizing her. People need to stop treating her like a spooky demon. The conclusion of Mary Jones' Encyclopedia entry about the Morrigan really distills how we should think of our relationship to her, in my opinion:

> To refuse Morrigan is to reject the land and the gods.

For the simplest advice: I would just say that as long as you are on her side, she is on yours. Perhaps she will make a major demand of you, and you must be prepared to fulfill it if she does. But honestly I don't see that as likely. For the most part, I would say to just praise her and sacrifice to her and she will favor you.

Theologically, though, I think our entire concept of the Morrigan is fraught with complications. For starters, what can our relationship with her really be if we have no tribe and no true link to the land? Also, why do we keep talking about "her" as a singular, global goddess? Is the Morrigan you know really the Morrigan from Old Irish Mythology? Would every region have its own "Morrigan(s)"?

These are weighty, even existential questions that I think we need to discuss. I wouldn't say that you should refrain from making offerings and praise to her before they're answered (perhaps they will never be answered), but these are the real things that I think should give us pause when approaching her rather than the demonizing scaremongering.

> How do you tell? What do you think the signs of being called by the Morrigan look like?

I've never felt "called" by her, so I can't speak to that. She has been told to reveal her identity by taking the form of a crow, so trite as that may be, that is a legitimate sign to consider. Keep in mind, though, that the crow is associated with multiple Celtic deities. She does not have a monopoly on it. And of course, most of the time a crow is just a damned crow. They have their own lives too, you know.

> What do you think the signs of wishful thinking look like?

If you start feeling her call as soon as you learn about her. If you just saw a crow (or other blackbird) with no other clear indications. If you want to be her devotee, maybe you're committing confirmation bias. If the signs and signals are not at all like the lore or other people's experiences. If the signs and signals are a little bit too like the lore or others' experiences (seems a little pat, or on-the-nose). After all, the Morrigan is not really known for being singular or being quite the same way twice.

I think that's about all I have to say on the topic. I'm not a Morrigan expert, but that's my impression of the various issues that come up when newbs make Morrigan threads here. I would like to get Morpheus Ravenna's The Book of the Great Queen, as I've heard good things about it including that it pulls together some otherwise hard-to-find source material.

Again, I don't necessarily think it's one of them. Corvids are fairly common symbols of different divine beings. Cathubodua, Eponá, Cath Badb (which is Cathubodua's interpretatio Hibernia), Bran, Odin, Woden, Lugus etc.

Shapeshifting too honestly.

HOWEVER, sure I can be wrong so I'll give you a few things to help you out.

The Great Queen by Morpheus Ravena has really good research done on the Morrigna (or Morrigan if you believe they are one entity).

There is this site by many priests of "The Morrigan", Coru Cathubodua, which includes Morpheus.

A few things to maybe help.

You want to know what helped me get over this? Read "The Darkening Age" by Nixey. It gives you a pretty good picture of why modern Christians are the way they are. After reading this, I didn't have those fears anymore..only an immense respect for the religions that came before the Abrahamic ones.

https://www.amazon.com/Darkening-Age-Christian-Destruction-Classical/dp/0544800885

Ronald Hutton's Stations of the Sun does a fantastic (if sometimes dry) job of exploring the development of the modern pagan wheel of the year and the holidays therein.

Hi, I'm late. I really feel like you two are connecting with Inanna - she is a very ancient queen deity who has moon, snake, and wings imagery as well as being a very dark/light goddess. She rules over Heaven and Earth, is connected to the Morning/Evening Star, and is a fertility/sex goddess as well as a war goddess. She's not a mother goddess, though, not soft n squishy at all. I think you should maybe try to read this book and see what that does for y'all. Book link]

Someone recently brought up the concept of divination ethics with me when I mentioned being a little freaked out by an interaction with a pendulum.
She recommended this book, which as I understand it can apply to practices beyond dowsing. It's not something I considered before, but I think in general when dealing with the kinds of things pagans deal with, something that we probably really ought to consider. <3


Apologies if I completely mistinterpreted your post, but I felt like this touched on an aspect of your thoughts above.


https://www.amazon.com/Dowsing-Ethics-Replacing-Intentions-Integrity-ebook/dp/B00YR1Y5OK

I have used wooden peg dolls - they are very cheap and can be made into anyone, and wood is a natural material so, also good. You can always put a drop or two of an essential or holy oil into the paint, sort of blessing them.

https://www.amazon.com/Decorative-Wooden-Peg-Doll-People/dp/B07FNL468N/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?keywords=wooden+peg+dolls&qid=1555928202&s=gateway&sr=8-2-spons&psc=1

I have had to do this pretty much because I have a personal pantheon that no one would ever have statues for. Making your own can be a spiritually rewarding activity anyway, even if some are available to purchase.

Mike Nichols has a collection of essays on the sabbats.

Book wise, "Stations of the Sun: A History of the Ritual Year in Britain" by Ronald Hutton is scholarly text detailing their origins and practices.

There are tons of videos on YouTube, you'll have to sort through them for those that focus on the historical side.

One of the oldest writings in the world is a prayer to Inanna, written by a priestess named Enheduanna. Read more here.

Here is a big book of Inanna's stories and hymns.

Among other interesting things, Inanna might be the first dying-and-resurrecting Underworld traveler, setting the stage for everyone from Persephone to Christ. Read about her Descent into the Underworld.

Books which may interest, especially for beginners (The first three are highly recommended)

Magic in Ancient Egypt: Revised Edition

Eternal Egypt: Ancient Rituals for the Modern World

Temple of the Cosmos: The Ancient Egyptian Experience of the Sacred

Following the Sun: A Practical Guide to Egyptian Religion, Revised Edition

Circle Of The Sun: Rites And Celebrations For Egyptian Pagans And Kemetics

The Egyptian Book of the Dead: The Book of Going Forth by Day: The Complete Papyrus of Ani Featuring Integrated Text and Full-Color Images (This book isn't much of a "for beginners"-- it's just a translated funeral text. Still a great read for Kemeticists, though.)

The Ancient Egyptian Prayerbook (Just a contemporary prayerbook which may interest)

I'm sure the OP has a more defined answer but if I had to guess given the Celtic design on their wings it's probably in reference to The Morrigan, a trio of/triple-goddess in Celtic paganism. She is sometimes likened akin to Odin in that they are both war gods and deal with conflict and the battlefield slain, and there is some overlap in worship in Celtic-Germanic syncretism. Unlike Odin, who is typically symbolized with his 2 ravens, the Morrigan is symbolized with 3 crows. I'm not well read on her but her devotees have quite a bit to say if you want to know more.