(Part 2) Best products from r/UFOs

> Economics is not a science and it never will be. By any chance, do you know of/about Richard Wolff? He's the first economist whose opinion I somewhat respect (and he backs it up with statistics, and historical analysis).
>
> I don't know much about economics, but I know they're trying to keep that shit a secret. - Lewis Black
>
> The kleptocracy is running rampant, and economists and VC swine are more to blame than most. I personally don't bet on races unless I have fixed the race myself, or know and trust who has. It's basically the fortune 500 / circle of kevin bacon investment strategy. The SEC calls it "insider trading".

I remember the "Is economics a science?" debate from the last day of class. The "for" side emphasizes how prices are observables and the point of science is to explain and predict observations, a box economics definitely checks.

I refer to "professional" economists as "paid court wizards". The only joke was if you put three economists in a room together, FOUR theories are going to come out of the room.

If you're looking for a decent economist to check out, try W. Brian Arthur and The Nature of Technology.

> Bayesian logic, or prognostication/prophecy/prediction as it is also known is not something humans do well. As a finance guy, you ought to know that prior performance is NOT an indicator of future returns! I do appreciate that you may have more depth to your individual posits than you made clear in your original post, for the purposes of brevity to increase the chance someone might ACTUALLY read what you wrote.

Actually, past performance is indeed an INDICATOR of future returns, it's just not a GUARANTEE.

I'm already well into my second draft incorporating the input I've received from this one. I'm already 4 times the length. Do you have any thoughts on how to dispense that at the end of the weekend?

> The Overton Window, if actual/real, would be a manifestation of a high level conspiracy designed to manipulate the public. I don't disagree that there is such a conspiracy, and the evidence for it is everywhere. But that is a tough sell to most people (because it is outside of that "overton window", lol).

Other than convinced the Overton Window is real, I agree with you again. That's why I'm not trying to sell anyone on it, but rather present my ideas and see what they think.

> For all either of us knows you could be completely right about everything that you posited that cannot be verified (which is the vast majority of it, as far as I can see), it is just preposterously unlikely unless you have god's direct help (depending on who you ask, this is not outside the realm of possibility either).

I totally agree. It's a good thing I don't necessarily go by "likelihood", but rather "best fit for the evidence". It's all a question of fitting the curve to the evidence.

> In general, I believe it is majorly your approach that must be modified, as it is what is leading you to untestable and unverifiable hypothesis that you are attempting to formalize and solidify into "fact" and "history". Bible code / mathematical analysis of text is equivalent to your approach and we humans are ridiculously good at finding what we are looking for and our biases indicate/suggest (perhaps especially when it isn't there to find). A good scientist posits, and then tests and verifies. If asked if their shoes are tied, they look down before answering.

> Good luck refining your ideas and TESTING them!

We agree again.

I see an important part of the testing is to see if the theory explains the already existing data. I do that by looking for the anomalous items which cannot be explained well. When I run this test on homo deus, it is EASILY the best fit I've found for the data set yet.

Thanks for reading and your great replies. They very much help me.

I like Canon and they have a nice line of DSLRs. The EOS Rebel T2i has an 18 megapixel sensor with low light sensitivity, etc. Amazon has the body for $700 and you could add a telephoto lens for.. well, depends what you want to shoot.

I see this one for $250. It's a 650-2600mm telephoto lens. It's heavy and would require a tripod to use, but it would be interesting to see what you could see on things far away. Big Canon lenses can cost thousands of $$, so this is way cheap by comparison.

This 50-250mm zoom for $210 would be something you could leave attached and carry around.

Good luck in your camera and ufo hunting. I hope I have a good camera with me if I ever see something interesting in the sky. I have a Canon Vixia HD video camera that is more multi-purpose for my needs, but it has some nice image stabilization.

I might have a good example. I was at the rally last weekend and saw this balloon/parachute thing that seemed to be dangling a camera to get a crowd shot. Here's a clip where I zoomed in. Sometimes a handheld shot with that much telephoto can get unstable, but I was sitting and had an elbow braced on my knee as I recall, that plus the image stabilization helped me get a decent hi-res closeup to identify the object was from airphotoslive.com.

The nice thing about the Canon DSLRs is that they can shoot 18 megapixel stills or HD video. The 2Ti is a replacement for the 1Ti. The new Canon that I am coveting is the 60D which goes for $1100 (body only) but they come out with something new and improved every couple of years.

EDIT: here's some marketspeak on the optical image stabilization used in the Vixia, I agree and thought it was pretty smooth compared to the previous generation of digital image stabilization I have used, and the small form factor makes for a camcorder that is easy to carry or even stick in your pocket. Here's a YouTube video of Vixia image stabilization.

A little further digging and I see in this review that the Canon 2Ti has optical image stabilization too. I haven't had my hands on one of these DSLR cameras but they seem to be getting better and better with each new release.

Hope that helps. And here's to having a camera in hand when you really need it! :)

Leslie Kean published an excellent book called UFOs: Generals, Pilots, and Government Officials Go on the Record and she and James Fox have an updated documentary based on this book called UFOs on the Record.

A lot of people disparage the alien encounter phenomenon but the late Dr. Mack's books on the subject are excellent, most recent: Passport to the Cosmos - it includes Dr. Mack's interviews with the students at Ariel school who had a mass encounter.

Hunt for the Skinwalker by Colm Kelleher and George Knapp is one of the most fascinating books - and definitely the freakiest - that I've ever read. It takes a clinical and journalistic approach to a completely bizarre collection of phenomena centered on the Skinwalker Ranch in Utah.

In the quote section, don't forget the astronaut from Apollo 17 who told Houston there was definitely something out there.

My advice on the website as a whole is to separate substantiated stories from unsubstantiated (like the Eisenhower meetings) - that's not a comment on whether or not these stories are legit, but I think it's more helpful for people unfamiliar with the phenomenon to have a resource of airtight reportage to look at.

Good site though - good luck!

If you cannot put this book down you should have take a look at "Masscontacts" and "50 years of Amicizia" (http://www.amazon.com/Years-Amicizia-Friendship-Stefano-Breccia/dp/148270983X). The case is in english better known as "Friendship Case"

I believe Charles Hall too, but problem is still he is the only public known witness regarding the Tall whites.

Regarding the "Friendship/Amicizia Case" you have

• dozens of involved Persons over a period from 1956 to 1980 regarding a "friendship" with an aliengroup in Pescara,Italy
  
  
• multiple of them who are known by name and have gone public. Their biography can be verified. Some of them are locally well known people.
  
  
• photos from the 50,60,70-ies from their friendships with the aliens (photos are always debatable, but still interesting photos)
  
  
• correspondending Newspaperarticles from UFO Sightings and Events that happened back then and which corresponding with the Story of the witnesses.
  
  Keep in mind this was no "hypnose regression" contact. It was a real contact between human and aliens for a period of over 40 years!
  
  You can also find a short docu on youtube:
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZn3ewgAHFk
  
  But the docu is missing some things from the books and have some additional stuff which has nothing to do with the "Amicizia" case (ex. the alleged Voltaire letter...).
  
  Imho the best publicly known and documented contact case in modern UFO History.
  
  Have a look at it. It's an amazing story. It tops the story/contact from Hall by far because there are different known sources about the contacts.

Such great comments here. And an excellent question with great framing. I'm currently reading UFOs: Reframing the Debate edited by Graham and it is truly excellent. It is a little bit more "advanced reading" in that it helps to have read some of the classics in UFOlogy, but really turns things upside down. I particularly love the work/writings of Joshua Cutchin that I encountered in this book: honestly some of the freshest, most interesting ideas I've come across in a long time.

> As far as the CIA being involved in controlling news, funding tabloids and so forth that's speculation, but speculation that I don't discount.

You don't think Ted Hansen put out enough to basically confirm that? The other is 'cui bono?'

The only person that benefits from keeping it covered up, is the person who benefits from it staying a secret. Pretending nothing is done to maintain that secret with a defense wing which spends ~500 Billion every year, & has also racked up ~6 Trillion in discretionary spending (it can't account for), and not to mention all the NGOs, non-profits, think tanks, agencies, etc, working on behalf of corporations or establishment institutions... Brookings Report comes to mind (which are constantly dropping negatives into the subject)....

And even worse they portray themselves as bumbling idiots while dropping bombs on Syrians, Russians, arming ISIS, aiding terror, causing blowback (though it always somehow works out in their stated interest, weird = cui bono?)

Well, the only thing Id say about it all is that the recommendations of the Robertson panel are (to an observer who isn't lobotomized) only the very, very tip of what their true actions are.

If it didn't need to be covered up, it wouldn't. If someone or all of them whoever "they" might be in this case (the controlling influences over the 5 media companies cough CIA [at least one of those powers])

Anderson Cooper interned at the CIA when confronted, he laughs it off, mocks it, saying in response to "Mockingbird" (the speaker inferring he is in the next evolution of the program), "that's from the 1950s dude".

And so we have the official denial line: stuff that happened then couldn't possibly happen now - ignore all the evidence it is please.

Editor of Major Newspaper says he planted news stories for the CIA

1981 - William Casey CIA Director: "We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false."?

Derailing Democracy: The America the Media Don't Want You to See:David McGowan - ISBN-10: 1567511848

>Mike Culbert, CIA quotes:
There is a de facto “secret government” operating nationally and internationally and involved in the highest circles of the U.S. government, exercising an impact over domestic policies and economics ranging between extreme influence to, at times, outright control. This extreme influence to outright control naturally includes the Presidency. The de facto “secret government,” much of whose intellectual —and financial—muscle are to be found in the New York office of the CFR, the great tax-free foundations, and certain international firms and corporations.

>Daniel K. Inouye, CIA quotes:
There exists a shadowy government with its own Air Force, its own Navy, its own fundraising mechanism, and the ability to pursue its own ideas of national interest, free from all checks and balances, and free from the law itself.

Sorry but if you are part of the UFO community, you are the problem. The UFO community had enough to go on back in the 90s, it should've been demanding answers and raising rallies after Benewitz and a dozen other incidents, along with various info dumps.

They've strung everyone along with disinformation and false promises, to which, all involved are useful idiots or wise to the ruse. There's no two ways about it.

I get it, Earth shattering. But it's open secrets elsewhere in the world. I hate US based cases (though well documented), as they always tell nothing but confirm the fact they are covering the stories, as usual, which should be enough ammo to make an actual push.

Consider if tens of thousands of rapes were being committed, hundreds of whistleblowers come out & say, 'yea this rape this is real' and the government says, "rape isn't that big of a deal to personal safety."

It's absurd. And that is the absurdity of UFOlogy, it has nothing to do with hoaxers or Youtube (which the information agents are obviously involved in). - How the CIA made Google

Im curious how not one researcher had realized that it was never about UFO Cases by and large, it was which ones that mattered. Failed to see the bigger picture.

Great news is you don't have to spend hundreds to get a very decent and fun quad-flying experience.

Here's one for about $35!

I can say first-hand that this is a great little quad with surprising features and agility. It's also true 3-channel radio control; not infrared like the little helicopters everyone monkeys with. This will give you great control and range.

Of course it won't go as fast or as high as the $300+ models but it's definitely worth the price. It has great lift and you can easily rig it with LED's for night flights no problem.

One caveat: the manual is very poorly translated.. but there are great translations from the community online so if you do purchase one, keep this in mind.

> I'm curious how much proof does one actually need?

I'm glad you asked that question, though I'll apply it to the ETH and UFOs in general rather than limiting myself to this one document. You can see what I think about OP's NSA document here and here.

I am partial to the framework Peter Sturrock uses in his book The UFO Enigma.

Sturrock proposes that we abandon the idea of a smoking gun. Ever since The Day the Earth Stood Still, people have awaited the day a saucer lands on the White House lawn and a dialogue begins. So we examine every bit of data from that perspective, asking ourselves if this is finally the compelling argument needed to seal the deal.

A better framework is to think of every bit of evidence in terms of a logarithmic system, like say decibels for sound. The salient point is that you have some "threshold" that you yourself have set. Say, when the arguments in favor pass the 100 dB range you are convinced. Maybe 30 dB range for your average r/UFOs user.

The NSA document you link to, for example, would add 0 dB in support of the ETH for me because it is a joking exercise and is not at all relevant. A better example is perhaps the classic Twining Memo. Maybe that adds 10 dB to your theory that some UFOs are ETs or whatever. Maybe you read up on the Condon Report's take on the 1956 Lakenheath case and this "genuine UFO" adds 20 dB. Over time as you study UFOs you'll come to acculumate a growing body of evidence, and you'll be forced to reevaluate your previous assesments and assumptions. Likewise your thresholds may very well change.

I suppose I'm evading your question by describing what I consider to be a sensible system rather than enumerating my own specific beliefs. I do believe that there are Unknowns. These Unknowns appear to be physical and appear to at least sometimes be "intelligently controlled" and appear to at least sometimes exhibit characteristics unobtainable by human technology as we know it. I also think that these Unknowns have been marginalized by many of the ruling powers around the world for decades [with the notable exception of France].

I frankly have no idea what the Unknowns are or where they come from, and I think it displays a lack of respect for the complexity of the issues at hand for people to watch half of the Disclosure Project on Youtube before declaring the Unknowns as Extraterrestrials.

Lmao, first off....I fucking love your username.

Anyways, I've had multiple bonafide sightings, so for me that's where I start. I usually just respond with "You mean you haven't seen one before?". If they are curious, I'll detail the best sightings I've had and explain why it was indeed unexplained. Sometimes they try to tell me it's all secret tech that the government has, and I'm sure some of it is, but I remind them that if that is indeed the case then we have been sitting on the equivalent of free energy for at least 70 years. That's a crime against humanity (and the planet) as far as I'm concerned.

Whether or not I've had sightings, the fact is that throughout the whole debacle with Project Sign / Grudge / Bluebook our own Government (while trying at certain points to deliberately explain it away) admitted to hundreds of cases that were full blown UFO sightings suspected of being extraterrestrial in origin. All other explanations had been totally ruled out. This is the one thing I always step the conversation into next.

If they still seem interested, I suggest they read Project Blue Book Exposed by Kevin Randle. He's very straight forward and no-nonsense, and this book also does an exemplary job of pointing out an obvious cover up at high levels. I actually have multiple copies on hand and have given away a dozen or so copies within the past decade. It usually jars people awake to the reality of it. So far, only one person I know who has read it claimed that the cover up was actually "the older generation not knowing any better", but that guy also spoon feeds himself mainstream propaganda by the metric ton, so..... Shows exactly why you don't force the information on people, as you said, because he wasn't very interested in reading it to begin with. He eventually did because I read a book he suggested previously, so he "owed me one" and I picked that one.

If they don't want to read books then I have recently been pointing people towards the Bob Lazar interview with Rogan or the documentary (or its extras on YouTube). I had issues with both the doc and interview, but I believe Bob Lazar is telling the truth and always have. Now that his stuff is right out there in an easily digestible format, I point people to it. It's been a starting point in this stuff for folks since 1989.

I'm sure people will argue why these are bad choices for entry-level stuff, and that's fine, they may be. But I'm open to other suggestions because this is a conversation that needs to be had between those of us who know damn well that there is something going on.

I personally don't know much about UFO literature, but I do have a good friend working on a project called The Truth Engine...it's a systematic way of developing the best arguments for subjects with controversy or disagreement. Long story short, the first book is on UFO's - The UFO Dialectic. The plan is to debate the three case studies in the book and simultaneously add more case studies to continue releasing new editions. I'm personally hoping it becomes wiki project so its more accessible to a broader audience, but nonetheless, it's a good primer, in my opinion.

I would recommend http://www.amazon.co.uk/Eerie-Silence-Searching-Ourselves-Universe/dp/0141037784

Paul Davies - The Eerie Silence

He's head of the SETI post-detection task force, and examines in LOTS of detail such things as the Drake equation and Fermi paradox, but also wants to push SETI in a new direction.

Like Mr Friedman probably suggesting, the searching for radio signals is a one in a billion chance, even if aliens exist and are everywhere in the universe, radio detection is STILL a one in a billion chance.

A better route would be to look for evidence of megastructures, or usage of neutron stars, or gamma ray bursts or other such exploited natural occurences used as "beacons"

He also has the worrying opinion ( as a member of SETI ) that alien life "probably" doesn't exist, based on things like the great filter etc.

Hey, but it's still worth looking, right?

In situ testimonials like this are really interesting to hear - thanks for posting. I'm particularly intrigued with the astronauts comments. Given the amount of training, the dedication to the job, the high bar for getting the opportunity - suggests to me that these are very solid, very grounded people. Of course, they don't say much in these particular recordings so hard to draw conclusions from this - but as we know, other astronauts have discussed encounters and other aspects of the space experience. Edgar Mitchell, for example, and his Noetic Sciences work. I recently read this book, which has a lot of great discussions on this and other "fringe" topics. Excellent writing, too.

Out of the Blue might be the first truly great UFO documentary. Lots of credible witnesses and footage.

UFOs and Nukes by Robert Hastings is intriguing and chilling. All of Hastings' research is compiled from primary military sources and documents. He found a pattern of UFOs appearing over our most secure nuclear sites. It could be streaming on Amazon / Netflix as well.

UFOs Over Earth is a great documentary series based off of MUFON's most compelling case files.

I would like to see the documentary on the Hudson Valley sightings but it doesn't seem to be online at the moment.
https://www.amazon.com/Night-Sky-Recall-UFO/dp/B00I4CA3P8/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

Here's a witness that saw three giant boomerang-shaped UFOs at the same location:

We were driving down NY State route 22 on our way back from Danbury in route to our home in Holmes, NY. (hamlet of the town of Pawling, NY).

As we approached the northern border of Putnam county where it meets the border of Dutchess county we saw many cars pulling off the shoulder of the road heading north on RT. 22.

As we looked over to see what all the fuss was about, we saw the most amazing display of lights. People got out of their cars and just stared at what looked like 3 huge boomerang-shaped objects just floating and emitting different color lights along the edge of what appeared to be some sort of spacecraft.

It made absolutely no noise whatsoever. They were floating over this huge pasture on the side of the road. There were approximately 15 cars pulled over watching this spectacle.

I was amazed at the enormity of these crafts. Although it was dark, it was a clear starlit night the each craft appeared to be approx. 1000’ wing tip to wingtip.

It wasn’t difficult to scale the objects as they floated over this huge pasture as they seemed like they were only a few hundred feet from the ground. I strained to make out more detail and all I could come up with was the fact they were metallic; not shiny, but not dull either. It reminded me of a spaceship one might see in a Star Wars movie.

The three objects just seemed to float there for a good long time. They would move side to side in what seemed like short distances from our point of view. The lights pulsated different colors along the thin edge of the crafts. We watched for about a half an hour before we started to feel the cold weather.

http://www.ufocasebook.com/2011/harlemvalley.html

FenderJazzbass (OP, deleted), first, congrats on your sighting - but be careful not to jump to alien conclusions too soon, as there may just be a mundane explanation for your sighting. Always be on the lookout for confirmation bias in your thinking! There is a great book you might want to check out called The True Believer: Thoughts on the Nature of Mass Movements (http://www.amazon.com/The-True-Believer-Movements-Perennial/dp/0060505915)

I'm guessing you are fairly young and relatively new to the subject of UFOs, and your posting history certainly seems to indicate a "desire to believe". You're going to get called out again and again, if for no other reason than your commenting history seems fairly uncritical and leans heavily toward the true Believer end of the spectrum, and, more importantly, relies pretty regularly on ad hominem attacks and ad hoc retractions of posts. This is all very suspicious behavior, if you are really looking to take this subject seriously, and have others take you seriously.

This is not an attack on you. Please take it as constructive criticism and keep looking up!

I think it has something to do with an increase in global, human consciousness. Some contraption is generating those patterns as the expression of the collective consciousness if that makes sense, very much like what happens in Stanislaw Lem's Solaris.

Great read. Basically a team of scientists leaves on a planet-sized brain, trying to communicate with it, and the brain creates the objects and creatures that are the most prominent on the guys' minds.

Now for who or what is generating those shapes (other creatures like us, or in another dimension, or a machine somewhere) I haven't the slightest clue, and I find it quite frustrating to be honest.

The field is overflowing with crackpots, flakes, religious lunatics and the odd reasonable person.
Look at the most credible sources first: Dr. John Mack, Gordon Cooper, Dr. David M. Jacobs, Timothy Good. Find the Russian documentary film "Men in Black" - NOT the American fable with Will Smith.
Then read some books by David M. Jacobs, Budd Hopkins, Timothy Good, Jacques Valle, Richard Dolan.

Books:
http://amzn.to/29G6xZP - UFOs & The National Security State - Richard Dolan
Earth, An Alien Enterprise - Timothy Good: http://amzn.to/29KQv0E
Walking Among Us: The Alien Plan to Control Humanity - Dr. David M. Jacobs
http://amzn.to/29KQD03

Earth: An Alien Enterprise

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Excellent book

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https://www.amazon.com/Earth-Enterprise-Shocking-Greatest-Cover-Up/dp/1605986380

Lightquest by Andrew Collins pretty much explains 90% of the UFO phenom for me. Add Daimonic Reality by Patrick Harpur and you're almost at 100%.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/LightQuest-Andrew-Collins/dp/0940829495

https://www.amazon.com/Daimonic-Reality-Field-Guide-Otherworld/dp/0937663093

Although there's still a little part of me which wants them to be piloted by actual aliens from outer space.

• Earth, An Alien Enterprise ~ Timothy Good
  
• David M. Jacobs books
  
• Abduction - John Mack