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Ok...I guess I should probably get this out of my system once and for all :)

Yes, I do have some experience with pushing hands, gained via sporadic Chen Taiji training and some extended exploration of what is colloquially know as internal strength / neijia (about 8 years or so). I'm not an expert but I know the tropes and can discern the real deal from the all too common bullshido.

The TL;DR, right up front: this is a very deep rabbit hole that is incredibly difficult to mine. Frankly, I'm not sure I'd recommended it UNLESS you have reliable, intelligent and easily accessible training partners. It's not something that can be kinda-sorta dug into for some kewl tricks. It's not something you can learn on your own.

After some years - and calculating the ROI on things, I decided that the sums just didn't add up.

Preamble:

In my opinion, the best common-language analog to internal strength / neijia may be what is now being called "invisible jiujitsu", per Jack Taufer, Henry Aikins and Rickson Gracie. As most of you are BJJers, I presume this term is familiar. If not, see this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbtIPkyGm4g

Having never met them, I can't speak to their fully methods but I can say that they appear to be converging on some aspects of neijia (structure, frame, stability etc) although whether other aspects are there or not I have no idea. Frankly, I'm not suprised: constrain a situation - such as two guys grappling for position - and eventually you will run into these sorts of little aha's. FFS, there's evidence of this sort of proto-body use with farmers and manual labourers.

Details:

Most people don't fully realise that taiji is a grappling based art (no newaza though). For an eye-opening (albeit limited) video, see these

https://youtu.be/Gb_CC3GE18M

https://youtu.be/lk-OITQqHP8?t=2m49s

Not what you thought, right? I know that the way it's mostly portrayed is as a thing little old ladies do in the park. In fact, IMHE, taiji is quite physically exhausting, has some very clever training tools (push hands being primary) and is a lifetime's study. NOTE: I have no intention of fielding any "oh yeah, well...where are these guys on the UFC stage? Why aren't they competing at the Olympics"? Just sharing my opinion / experience and not looking to justify anything beyond that.

I don't have too much time right now, so will discuss in point form.

(1)

IF you could find someone sensible to train with that wasn't entirely into gazing at their navel and eating granola (difficult) NOR entirely about "just use some body english, dude" (difficult), THEN push hands is useful. The chances of you finding someone to do this with are vanishingly small - God knows I tried for a period of 5 or so years.

BTW, here is an example of shitty push hands, explained

https://youtu.be/kNAV_AurtKI

(2)

The utility of push hands is in regards to absorbing, deflecting, redirecting and adding force. This not simply a matter of taisabaki or gripping. What does this mean? It means that neijia is a method of "body management" and push hands is one of the best training methods.

Bearing in mind that this is just an example - and not a spectacular one at that, nor is it combat (again, just an example of mechanics) you can get a idea here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLB9TxuQ4kk

Perhaps a more familiar example here

https://youtu.be/MZ4w4yntGnM

Again, here's Rickson

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbtIPkyGm4g

Now....watch Inoue...can you see how he manages his body in a similar fashion? See how he's always causing his partner to push themselves off balance, basically throwing themselves? Believe it or not, this is considered low hanging fruit of IS skills.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiHS479uee8

(3)

Judo has a bunch of references to this sort of body use. A classic one is to be found in Harrison's "The Fighting Spirit of Japan" (if you've not read this, you should. Harrison was one of the first Westerners to study martial arts in Japan - it's a great travelogue)

https://www.amazon.com/Fighting-Spirit-Japan-Esoteric-Martial/dp/0879511427

(4)

A more contemporary example is GoNoKata. There are many video clips now of GNK but to my eye, this is the only one that embodies these concepts of body management

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVF4dHzXklo

(5)
The best (albeit dated) treaties on this material -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FanJUCaUOO4

Summary:

So, is push hands useful? Yes. Should you pursue it, in hopes of developing your Judo? Honestly...probably not. The chances of finding someone to do it correctly / beneficially are pretty small.

To end on a touch of pretension (and to show off my many thousand dollar outstanding student debt) -

• Ars longa,
  
• Vita brevis
  
• Occasio praeceps,
  
• Experimentum periculosum
  
• Iudicium difficile
  
  PS: The real mindfuck for you here: if Judo was MEANT to use these principles....and 99.999% have no idea of them or use them....then are we really doing Judo as it was intended? Things that make you go hmmm :)

Buy this book and study it: http://www.amazon.com/Judo-Formal-Techniques-Complete-Kodokan/dp/080481676X

I only had time for a quick view but first and foremost --- you guys just need more time to learn to work together better. 2 weeks is unreasonable expectation because part of the kata is learning how to move with your partner in everything and getting the mutual timing together. Kata is a fluid stylistic presentation not just a patchwork of techniques with some shuffling into position between the throws. Practice will get you there.

For example, one issue is one of you takes a very long time to straighten their gi after the first set...way too long so the first guy turns first. Not good (one trick people do is to snap their belt twice to tighten the knot and indicate they're ready...1, 2, turn-- cheesy but acceptable often). Also in general, many of your movements need fluidity. That is something you will get by practicing more.

The mat presence is sloppy (ex's- you make big clumsy steps not fluid smooth gliding steps, you are getting up with your left leg first and pushing off your knee, Uke is not giving enough for some techniques and giving too much for others - minor but makes it sloppy over all). Your bowing needs work. If you are the bearded guy, you barely bow to the judges. They may not seem like a big deal but could be off putting to some (your end bow was better). Match it all with Uke.

More specifics: the uki otoshi definitely needs some work so does the Harai (no kuzushi?!). The kata guruma can be cleaned up a bit. Uke needs to work on falling in the proper locations. Sorry to say but the Uchi mata was not good. I don't believe you should be lifting but pulling them around in tighter and tighter circles and flow into the throw.

Please check out the book I linked. Its very specific and will help out a ton. And I hope you have someone kata certified guiding you? Keep practicing --- you made a lot of progress in 2 weeks so imagine how nice it can be in 6 months. But take everything very seriously (from bowing, to the tiny kuzushi specific to each throw, to the specific way you both arise from the ground). Good luck!

Edit: typos and thank you for my first gold, kind Judoka.

I don't know any site, that has "everything", which might be impossible, since Judo doesn't have a closed canon but merely a core of techniques and an endless "outer zone" where everything that abides to the principle of "maximum efficiency" belongs.

Anyway... Judoinfo.com might be a good starting point to get an overview:

http://judoinfo.com/techjudo.htm

The Kodokan has an overview about the officially recognized throws and grappling techniques, but only a few techniques are described in the Nage Waza Digest. A plus is, that you can find several Kata handbooks for free in PDF format:

http://kodokanjudoinstitute.org/en/waza/list/

There are some very good Youtube channels, that provide elaborate collections of videos:

Mercuryu

Jesus Perez

Hal Sharp

Judovision

All About Judo

Komlock

Beyond Grappling

For everything on the ground there's the BJJ Collective:

http://www.bjjcollective.com/

Last but hopefully not least, there are my 10 lists of good and bad examples of Judo throws. Here's the entry point (use the top to navigate the lists, the actual links to the videos are in the respective top comment below):

https://redd.it/2qh230

---

If you are willing to buy a book, "Kodokan Judo" gives a pretty good overview ober Judo's core:

https://www.amazon.com/Kodokan-Judo-Essential-Founder-Jigoro/dp/156836539X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1474621036&sr=8-1&keywords=Kodokan+Judo

For books, this is THE book for nage-no-kata. I recommend using this for specific techniques that you are having trouble with, as it is extremely extensive.

I recommend watching the world champions in nage-no-kata, and try to emulate them to the best of your ability. Most commissions that judge you, use the IJF NNK guideline to assess your kata, but that depends on the federation.

Before you start adding mistakes into your kata and waste time, start by emulating the best in the world (above video). Sure it won't look that nice in the end, but it's important to have a vision to go after. Another tool is to videotape yourself practicing, this serves two purposes; 1) it allows you to watch in slow-motion all of the stuff that goes wrong 2) you can go back and watch previous videos to see how much it is improving, this is a morale boost.

For specific techniques it's best to either upload a video of one of the demonstrations or ask specific questions. Nage-no-kata as a whole is a big topic, and difficult to cover in its entirety. I'll gladly help you on your way.

Nothing wrong in wanting to be recognized for the hard work you put in. That being said, however, most National Judo organizations have a set minimum time frame you must be in Judo before you can grade for a black belt. I believe the minimum is 3 years, at least that's what it is in Canada. As well, although there are many similarities between judo and wrestling, there are also many many more differences. Posture, how to use strength, etc. But I have known many wrestlers who transitioned to judo very nicely.
As far as books go, the #1 book I always recommend is "Kodokan Judo: The Essential Guide to Judo" https://www.amazon.ca/Kodokan-Judo-Essential-Guide-Founder/dp/156836539X

I also bought this book when I first started judo and I found it very helpful:

https://www.amazon.ca/Mastering-Judo-Masao-Takahashi/dp/073605099X

Hopefully this helps! Judo is really fun and after I stopped wrestling I went to Judo and never looked back! Enjoy the journey my friend :)

I am 5' 7", 180 lbs (30 lbs overweight), and I recently got a Fuji (Keiko, but they rarely state the name in the ads) Size 5. The pants need to be taken up, but it fits well because I have broad shoulders.

For example:

https://www.amazon.ca/Fuji-FW-0-PARENT-Uniform-White/dp/B00GII1H9Q/ref=sr_1_2?crid=2H6K0J8E5JVQ6&keywords=fuji%2Bjudo%2Bgi&qid=1554983450&s=gateway&sprefix=fuji%2Bjudo%2Caps%2C154&sr=8-2&th=1&psc=1

Then I saw another one - exactly the same make, 'model' and size for about half that price, so I bought it as a backup, and it fits slightly differently - it is a little smaller. So much for consistency.

Be aware that some of the more expensive gis are pre-shrunk, so you do not have to worry about them shrinking any more. If you get a gi that is not pre-shrunk, do not put it in the dryer.

I am saying this because you might want to get an oversized gi deliberately, so that you can put it in the dryer to shrink it when you first get it, and then, after that, you will never have to let it drip dry, and can throw it in the dryer any time.

I ended up calling Fuji distributor when I bought my second gi, just to make sure it was the same model as my first gi, and to make sure the size was right. I would do that, if I were you.

If I were buying again, I would get a size 6 and shrink it.

Good luck.

buy yourself a copy of starting strength it will teach you everything you need to know to begin sport related strength training. basically the exercises that are being mentioned here, squat, deadlift, powerclean, also bench press and overhead press.

to starting strength I have added dips, chins, sprints, and I wish my gym had a climbing rope.

disclaimer: I've been weight training significantly longer than I've practiced judo. I would like to say that there are no exercises that will directly relate to anything. to get better at judo you must do more judo. being strong helps out in a multitude of other life-related things, It's really important to me that I be physically strong. but it hasn't given me much of an advantage in judo. at least not over someone who is generally physically fit. I can deadlift 400lbs, the only time I felt this was applicable in a judo situation was while training turtle turnovers, which I've never actually seen done in competition. I've been owned in newaza by smaller dudes who either haven't lifted in a long time, or don't actively lift. my weight training felt useless.

what I'm saying is, it's not that big of a deal, if you're physically weak, you need to get stronger, but don't expect it to really help your judo that much.

Hey man, the design is online now! Here's the German link: https://www.amazon.de/dp/B07VRS4G7Y
And here's the American one: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07VLBPL7J

Thanks again for your support, hope you like the shirts :)

Wow what a great deal! I'd buy one for that price right this moment. Sadly if I google for that same thing I get https://www.amazon.com/Fuji-Double-Weave-Judo-Uniform/dp/B00GII15Q6?th=1&psc=1 which is $95.00 for size 7. Congrats!

I am a big fan of Mark Rippitoe's starting strength.

https://startingstrength.com/

https://www.amazon.com/Starting-Strength-Basic-Barbell-Training/dp/0982522738

I highly recommend this book for anyone interested in being stronger.

I am a beginner also ( 4 KYU, Orange belt here ) and have found the kodokan book a good start.

This is a book that has a lot of basic info and try to teach some of the concepts of giving way instead of counter pushing. Also have a good show with pictures and text of all the throws and several newaza techniques.

If anybody else knows more beginner / intermediate books for judo i would appreciate it!

https://www.amazon.com/Kodokan-Judo-Essential-Founder-Jigoro/dp/156836539X

Yes, it does. Or it did. Most people don't know or drill it though. The concept use to be discussed on Judo Forum back in the day by the likes of Sir Harry Flashman. It can get a little esoteric. The four legged animal concept is the starting point.

Some of us have argued that Go-no-kata trains this exact thing.

Let me be honest with you: unless your instructor is aware and/or willing to explore these ideas, you're probably not going to find this material useful. The way judo is typically train precludes much development of this stuff. Ask me how I know :)

EDIT: Read / watch the above stuff, then read Harrison's Fighting Spirit of Japan, specifically his judo interactions and demonstrations.

I figure this guy had it pretty well figured out.

You reckon the current bunch at the IJF know better?

You have to click on the used ones:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00GII15Q6/ref=olp_f_used?ie=UTF8&f_used=true&f_usedAcceptable=true&f_usedGood=true&f_usedLikeNew=true&f_usedVeryGood=true

They are still in the packaging, I believe they are ones that are returned, like someone bought it, it didn't fit so they returned it to Amazon, they can't sell them as new anymore, even though they are.

Mine was perfectly new, not even washed once, with all the tags still on it.

If you're a beginner then books probably won't help you much other than learning the names of the techniques.

I do highly recommend you reading this book though

https://www.amazon.com/Falling-Hard-Journey-into-World/dp/1590307151

the guy started judo when he turned 50 and got his shodan. It's a love letter to judo and basically includes a short history of the golden age of judo.

spoiler alert... this book is a great reference but won't give you that boost that you're looking for.

This book impacted my judo more so than the Kodokan Judo book: https://www.amazon.com/Judo-Unleashed-Essential-Techniques-Intermediate/dp/0071475346/ref=pd_day0_b_14_4/147-9403292-3359160?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=0071475346&pd_rd_r=74bde955-5aee-11e9-93ae-4b1193112941&pd_rd_w=lgbd7&pd_rd_wg=Ydmns&pf_rd_p=b21f843a-654c-40f8-899e-282283dbe728&pf_rd_r=Y9GJ0NH6EDCV7XJ73F1T&psc=1&refRID=Y9GJ0NH6EDCV7XJ73F1T

The Way of Judo is one of my favorites a smooth read but contains some factual errors that I had forgotten about. See /u/Geschichtenerzaehler's comment below. The books /u/Ryvai mentioned are good too.

But since you're here from BJJ for some Judo history, I want to take a minute to correct some straight up historical revisionism that I see a lot in BJJ.

1. Mitsuyo Maeda was a Judoka, not a Jujitsu student. As far as I have been able to find he didn't study Jujitsu for a single day of his life, just Sumo and Judo.
   
   
2. Yamashita Yoshiaki studied JJJ as a young man, but when he came to America he was a high ranking Judoka and taught Judo, not Jujitsu, to Americans, including President Roosevelt. Judo was very purposefully named, and Yamashita would never have called what he was teaching anything but Judo.
   
   
3. The quote by Teddy Roosevelt saying "The art of Jiu Jitsu is worth more in every way than all of our athletics combined" is 100% locally grown organic bullshit.
   
   
4. Kano to the best of my knowledge never once referred to Judo as "Kano Jiu Jitsu." Some other people did, including the wretched H Irving "This book says The complete Kano Jujitsu but I should say this book teaches nothing of my Judo" Hancock. Kano put a ton of thought into the name Judo, and while some newspapers in Brazil may have erroneously called it "Kano Jiu Jitsu," no one in Japan did, least of all Kano or any of his students.
   
   I used to think that BJJ just didn't care about getting the history right, but after two recent articles by Robert Drysdale I'm beginning to think it's an intentional revising of history to make BJJ seem like The One True Art and Judo its trivial footnote of a cousin. Seriously, click on both articles, control-f search for "Judo" and "Kano." Article One. Article Two. They're also good reads if you are interested in the direction of BJJ, but I was alarmed by how wrong he gets some of the historical facts.
   
   EDIT: spelling

This is a wonderful book to have around. Very detailed information and pictures with nearly every throw, choke and armlock; as well as philosophical information, a brief history and some tips on solo training.

I have a question - is the Kodokan Judo book THE official/complete tome on Judo curriculum/techniques?

My go to books other than Kodokan Judo are the Canon of Judo by Kuyozo Mifune and Judo Unleashed by Neil Ohlenkamp.

Kodokan Judo by Jigoro Kano is highly recommended. It explains all the basics of Judo from techniques to even first aid. As you know, Jigoro Kano is the founder of Judo and he did publish one book in English in his lifetime but it’s now out of print. Part of that book that was published in his lifetime is in that new book which was published years after his death and dedicated in his name. The majority of that book is written by member(s) of the Kodokan, which is the first Judo dojo and the spiritual headquarters of the judo community. The book was made to meet the growing demand for a standard book on Judo

It's a step-by-step guide to nage no kata for both tori and uke. Very informative.

Edit: Book link
https://www.amazon.com/Judo-Formal-Techniques-Complete-Kodokan/dp/080481676X