(Part 10) Reddit mentions: The best christian theology books

> I'm going to say some hard words.

Don't worry. It takes quite a lot for me to take offense.

I can understand where you're coming from since that was my opinion for much of my life. But let me shed some light on why I've changed my tune while still retaining my testimony in the Family Proclamation:

The church has recently gone through great efforts to infuse an attitude of compassion and understanding on this topic. See: Mormons and Gays site and Church's response to HRC campaign on same-sex attraction. Please note that I'm not cherry-picking here, these are all recently published, authoritative statements which, in my mind, all point at a call for Latter-Day Saints to strive to show more love and understanding.

Some quotes from those resources:

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> This Church has felt the bitter sting of persecution and marginalization early in our history, when we were too few in numbers to adequately protect ourselves and when society’s leaders often seemed disinclined to help. Our parents, young adults, teens and children should therefore, of all people, be especially sensitive to the vulnerable in society and be willing to speak out against bullying or intimidation whenever it occurs, including unkindness toward those who are attracted to others of the same sex. This is particularly so in our own Latter-day Saint congregations. Each Latter-day Saint family and individual should carefully consider whether their attitudes and actions toward others properly reflect Jesus Christ’s second great commandment - to love one another.

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> Latter-day Saints believe that our true commitment to Christian teachings is revealed by how we respond to this commandment. This love is tested every day of our lives. We may know individuals with same-sex attraction in our workplaces, congregations and town halls. As people with hopes, fears and aspirations like everyone else, these neighbors deserve our love. But we can’t truly love the neighbors next door if we don’t love the neighbors under our own roof. Family members with same-sex attraction need our love and understanding. God loves all his children alike, much more than any of us can comprehend, and expects us to follow.

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> As a church, nobody should be more loving and compassionate. Let us be at the forefront in terms of expressing love, compassion and outreach. Let’s not have families exclude or be disrespectful of those who choose a different lifestyle as a result of their feelings about their own gender.

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> If we want to understand one another we have to see ourselves in one another. Open the book of each individual life and you will find a familiar story. We all need forgiveness, because we all sin. We all need comfort, because we all suffer.


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In 2007 I felt compelled to re-examine the, frankly, homophobic attitudes which I had about homosexuality. Whenever I would be faced with that topic I was filled with a set of emotions, none of which I could identify as love or charity. I happened on the book Born That Way by Erin Eldridge which is her insightful and heart-wrenching account of her struggle with same-sex attraction. In the end it is a powerful testimony of the Savior and His atonement and love, and the love of church members and leaders being what enabled her to repent and return to full fellowship in the church and happily start an eternal family. This book rooted out my negative attitudes towards homosexuality and homosexuals and replaced it with a desire to love and show compassion.

BTW, the premise of that book, the homosexual feelings is not necessarily a choice has been reaffirmed by the church:

> The experience of same-sex attraction is a complex reality for many people. The attraction itself is not a sin, but acting on it is. Even though individuals do not choose to have such attractions, they do choose how to respond to them. With love and understanding, the Church reaches out to all God’s children, including our gay and lesbian brothers and sisters.

Before I read that book I viscerally held a different opinion on that matter.

All of this combined with living next to two very loving and compassionate homosexuals for the past 7 years has, IMO, helped me choose to be filled with love on this topic. And daily showing love towards my literal neighbors and attending their ceremony, giving a hug, and expressing to them that I'm happy for them seem like small tokens of that love. That I could show up and celebrate their humanity while simultaneously not condoning the sin. Similar to how I can go do a business function or wedding that serves alcohol and still have a positive time and opinion of those around me.

Okay. Now, despite all of the above my testimony in the principles laid out the Family Proclamation is still strong. However, I believe that that revelation was not given from hate. It is up to each of us as Latter-Day Saints to find the compassionate interpretation of that proclamation--to find what fruits of love we can cultivate from that.


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Finally, what has solidified my choice to err on the side of love on this matter is what I put myself in other's shoes and ask myself, "What would be my attitude and response if one of my children chose to act on homosexual feelings that they had?" Would I feel sad? Yes, because I firmly believe in the blessings and God's covenants and commandments. But would I disown? Neglect? Ignore? Disdain? Isolate? No! And that has been re-affirmed by recent council:

> Let’s not have families exclude or be disrespectful of those who choose a different lifestyle as a result of their feelings about their own gender.

> Elder Quentin L. Cook

So it's up to all of us to decide how we balance love and law in our lives. But I have been drawn more towards love.

So treat this post here as the "How" to my reaction to the above. For the "Why", see this comment here and also this blog post which I've recently done (which just talks about charity in general, not on the topic of homosexuality).

First of all, welcome back, brother. I am especially touched that your fiancée would even suggest to find a Catholic Church. (As an aside, you're not a convert; you're a revert since you're already baptized into the Church. I thought maybe you'd appreciate that factoid.)

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>I am looking for information about your Church, whatever you think is important to know.

There is a lot to know and many here would recommend a million and one things to study, especially since it sounds like you enjoy a good intellectual pursuit. I'm not going to discount others' recommendations, but I do want to highlight one thing: learn more about Jesus first. Find out what He taught, who He is, what His disciples and closest friends said about Him, what the Old Testament said about Him, etc. To that end...

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>I am looking for recommendations for a Catholic-approved version of the Bible, geared towards someone who appreciates philosophy and prefers something close to the original translations, or the most accepted by the Church.

First thing to note, all Catholic Bibles have 72 books. Protestants have 66. If you can't get a hold of a Catholic Bible, a Protestant one will do for now until you do get around to buying a Catholic one. Now, as for Catholic Bibles, if you speak/read Latin you can't go wrong with the Vulgate Bible. It's a Bible that was translated by St. Jerome who was fluent in Hebrew, Greek, and Latin; he had the original manuscripts -- some of which are lost to us today -- so his translations are widely accepted as authentic and faithful.

There's also the English version of the Vulgate Bible known as the Douay-Rheims. It's an almost word-for-word translation of the Latin so the English will sound archaic to our modern ears. It's not as frustrating as, say, reading Shakespeare but it's pretty close. I personally prefer (and currently use) a Douay-Rheims Bible that has the Clementina Vulgata beside it. It's essentially Latin and English side by side. You can find one here.

If want one with plain English, the New American Bible Revised Edition would suffice. (If you use this website, let me know. I have a discount code from my last purchase.)

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>I know nothing of the culture or norms of the Church, or what to expect as a new member.

One major rule to remember is that you can't receive Holy Communion until after you've gone to Confession. Given your situation, I would recommend setting up an appointment with a parish priest so he can give his full attention to you and your needs.

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>I do not know how to introduce myself to the congregation

There's usually no need to introduce yourself to the congregation since parishes tend to be big. If you would like to formally introduce yourself, however, give the parish priest a call and set up a meeting with him. It would also be a great chance to speak with him about your situation and get some pastoral guidance.

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>or tell a good Catholic church from a lesser one

Many here would recommend a more traditional parish. If that's not available, I'd say any Catholic church would do. If you're unsure about a particular church's standing, just give us the details on this sub. I'm sure someone here would be able to double check for you.

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>I know nothing of the Saints or the miracles, or what has been confirmed by the Church and what hasn't.

These are things you can learn later on. Focus on Jesus first. Rebuild your relationship with Him. Start with the basics; if you don't, you might burn yourself out. There is A LOT to learn about the Faith. Some say it's a lifelong endeavour. :P

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>I am also looking for a reading list to explore Catholic philosophy beyond those you typically encounter in standard philosophical reading, such as Aquinas or Pascal.

Hmmm... this depends on what sorts of things interest you. A good one that lightly touches on philosophy is Socrates Meets Jesus by Peter Kreeft (anything by this guy is pretty good, by the way).

A book that may be more pressing to your current situation is Why Be Catholic? by Patrick Madrid and Abraham Skorka, Why We're Catholic by Trent Horn, as well as Why I am a Catholic by Brandon Vogt. (They might need to work on a more original title, though :P) Since you have an Evangelical background, Crossing the Tiber by Steve Ray might be helpful (although it can be a bit dry; also, it mostly deals with the Church's teaching on Baptism and the Eucharist) as well as Rome Sweet Home by Scott and Kimberly Hahn.

You can never go wrong with classics such as a collection of C. S. Lewis' works, The Divine Comedy by Dante Alighieri, The Seven Story Mountain by Thomas Merton, and Confessions by St. Augustine.

If you want a historical examination of Jesus and the Early Church, a good place to start is The Case for Christ by Brant Pitre, The History of the Church: From Christ to Constantine by St. Eusebius, and The Fathers Know Best by Jimmy Akin. I'd like to thrown in Jesus, Peter, and the Keys by Scott Butler, Norman Dahlgren, and David J. Hess. This last one pertains to the Catholic claim regarding the papacy (and which I think is one of the strongest arguments in favour of the Catholic Church being the original one that the Lord founded).

Finally, there are YouTube channels you can follow/binge watch such as Bishop Robert Barron and Ascension Presents. Also, an amazing video about the Catholic Faith is a series made by Bishop Barron when he was "just" a priest called Catholicism.

I'm sorry if that's overwhelming but you raised some good questions. :P Anyway, I imagine it may be a lot right now so take it slowly, don't dive in through all of it at once. Find a local Catholic church, call up the priest, set up a meeting, then take it from there. And remember, you can always pray; God's always willing to talk with you.

In some ways you could still say I'm a Gnostic, but I'm also an atheist. I didn't used to be. I used to be really into religion. I studied various religions for 10 or so years, and I believed that there was a link between them all, some half-understood glimpse into a supernatural world. Initiation never ends, though, so one day I came to see the emptiness in that as I'd seen emptiness in everything else. There's truth in the metaphors of mysticism, but it's not truth about the world, it's truth about human beings and what they are.

Ein Sof is the unmanifest complete nature of "God", right? Well really that's just your deepest self, the part that isn't your petty emotions and worldviews, the part that fuels the Logos of the manifest self, yet sits and watches in stillness as the storm churns around it. Identification of self with thoughts is deficiency, as Sophia, who is wisdom, tries to understand the world without that concept of a quiet inner self, but of one that partakes in emotional turmoil fully and feels as though that's where it is, bringing about a false self. This is the Demi-urge and its Archons, our controlling and hostile self-imposed restrictions and our deficient interpretation of our relationship to the world. Gnosis is a realization of unity, not with the deficiency, but with the Pleroma and Logos, the manifestation of Ein Sof. It's identification with that stillness and quietness at the heart of the self, the place that the storm doesn't touch. Whether or not there's more to that stillness is, well, open to interpretation.

Some good books to take a look at, if you want to know about the cosmology of Gnosticism, are Gnosis of the Cosmic Christ by Tau Malachi, and On the Mystical Shape of the Godhead by Gershom Scholem. Also, really, if you just want a basic outline of some of the cosmology, take a look at Wikipedia. Look at the capitalized letters in these last couple of posts and see what they have to say about them. As far as just addressing the ideas, they're pretty good.

Really, though, cosmology isn't that important, what's important is what the cosmology is trying to reflect. You should also read the story of Krishna and Arjuna on the battlefield, which is in the Bhagavad Gita, and basically the entirety of the Tao Te Ching. The Heart of Understanding by Thich Nhat Hanh is another good read that gets into some of this stuff that's really the core of the point of it all.

The thing is, a lot of this stuff is non-verbal. You can learn as much from extended periods of mindfulness meditation as you can from reading about it, and, really, if you're going to actually understand it, you have to do some work within yourself. If you can't ever differentiate the cloud of your emotions from the self that you are, you're not going to see the sign posts in the text in front of you. Eventually their shape might sort of point you in the right direction, though, and that is, presumably, the hope. Like a Zen koan, it's a finger pointing at the moon. Try not to get caught up in the finger. Along that line of thinking, take a look at the introduction to Magick in Theory and Practice by Aleister Crowley, but first, read this quote from Liber O.

>In this book it is spoken of the Sephiroth and the Paths; of Spirits and Conjurations; of Gods, Spheres, Planes, and many other things which may or may not exist. It is immaterial whether these exist or not. By doing certain things certain results will follow; students are most earnestly warned against attributing objective reality or philosophic validity to any of them.

There are many ways to interpret the things Crowley says. He definitely seems to have had some delusional periods in his life, but he is an excellent representation of a finger pointing at the moon.

Personally, I think religion needs to fade into the darkness of history and take as much ignorance and woo with it as possible. There are, however, valuable transmissions of non-verbal information going on, but I think they can be secularized. Crowley managed to get his students to play with the stuff while supposedly not expressly believing in its literal validity or the literal truth of the cosmologies related to it, so there ought to be other ways of doing that.

Anyway, that's just me. I couldn't tell you whether most Gnostics today or ~300CE believed the cosmology literally or believed it in the context of their experience of themselves and their connection with the world. I don't know of any studies regarding it. I'm pretty sure there aren't that many Gnostics.

I don't know of any services or anything. I certainly don't go to any. If you have any questions about Gnosticism or whatever you can certainly ask, though. It seems that I still enjoy typing about it.

Probably not here though, because this has nothing at all to do with physics.

Would you mind explaining what you meant when you wrote

>If he doesn't... well, he obviously isn't. => rather than <=>. Christ.

I'm just not following but you potentially have a good point.

Edit: Since they don't seem to want to respond to me, I'll go ahead and explain what I thought they were trying to get at.

The usefulness of apologetics that argue for the existence of "God", generically, is debatable. They can be used to some effect with people, but they all fall short. Christians, however, have a very unique advantage in trying to prove the existence of God. We believe that God has acted in history to such an extent that we can know it just about as well as we can know any event from that time period. And He has done so in the person and work of Jesus Christ. Starting with Christ, it is much easier to work your way back to God.

The argument basically goes that if Christ really did exist and do what Scripture says He did, then God must exist because Christ is God incarnate acting in human history. And the evidence that we do have suggests that Christ did exist and do what Scripture says He did. Therefore, God exists.

Dr. John Warwick Montgomery is a phenomenal Christian apologist and has developed what I think is one of the most robust defense of the Christian faith. I strongly recommend this playlist of lectures and interviews he has given that lays out his argument.

Another excellent name in the field of apologetics is Dr. Gary Habermas of Liberty University. He had a long friendship with the man who literally wrote the book on atheism, Dr. Antony Flew. They held several public debates, during which Dr. Flew had to admit that the conclusion of Christianity is a logical conclusion to the evidence that we have. The transcript and an analysis of their last public debate is available in the book Did the Resurrection Happen? A Conversation with Gary Habermas and Antony Flew.

You're clearly well-versed in this subject, I actually wasn't expecting a response that involved knowledge of quantum entanglement and particle/wave duality!

> You haven't even functionally defined consciousness, so how could I possibly explain it?

Were you aware, in your mind ("consciousness") that you were alive and typing this at the time you did? If so, that would make you conscious and not a "philosophical zombie".

Of course I could veer this completely off course and say that I don't even known that you exist, and I could just be playing a game in the only consciousness there is. My own.

Solipsism

> I'd have to argue that it's pretty much exclusively your unconscious mind that takes input from the photo-receptors in your mind. This is not a conscious process.

Correct.

> I would certainly agree with your point about quantum uncertainty, but I fail to see how it relates to the discussion of consciousness.

In my personal opinion, it has everything to do with it. It's the only possible solution to how we can have free-will and are not just unconscious robots ("philosophical zombies"). Without quantum effects, we could not be sentient beings that are free to make our own decisions, based on our own choices.

Not just (input in = input out) ... but (input in = conscious decisions = input out).

This quick search on Amazon will show how many books deal with this very subject.

I've read most of them. Some much more interesting than others. I'd say the best book I've ever read on these matters is by Paul Davies ... The Mind of God: The Scientific Basis for a Rational World. "Biocentrism" was also somewhat interesting, as was Fire in the Mind: Science, Faith, and the Search for Order.

Your points are all valid, and I won't go over every single one of them.

Should I assume that you believe in the emergent theory of consciousness? Where it arises at a certain neural threshold, for reasons we have no idea?

And where is the "seat of consciousness"? For a while, it was thought it was the pineal gland, then other places. Then we started removing half of people's physical brain matter and that made them better. So exactly where is this consciousness?

If it's emergent, that means I myself as a software developer just need to write a complex enough system. And then, like magic, my creation is self-aware?

For the record, I did really enjoy the movie Ex Machina.

>you imbecile

I can already tell this is going to be fun.

>Jesus has literally ZERO contemporary historical data.

That's not what you asked for. You asked for peer-reviewed arguments for the historical existence of Jesus, of which I said there are thousands, and to which I said you'd have a much more difficult time finding the opposite--- peer reviewed articles and books arguing that Jesus was entirely a myth.

>I’ll wait for those libraries of sources you have.

Where do you want to start?

Probably the best place for you to start is with Bart Ehrman, a leading scholar of on the development of Christianity, and he's also a popular skeptic speaker and writer. In addition to publishing he's written popular books about how many of the books of the Bible were forgeries, and how the belief that Jesus was divine developed in early Christianity, he also wrote an entire book laying out the widely accepted case that Jesus was likely a real historical person, written directly to skeptical lay people like yourself.

If you want a great introduction to the scholarly debate about the historical Jesus, you could start here or here. I also think Dale Allison's work is great critical look at some of the issues at work in the debate. There are lots of historical reconstructions of Jesus' life. Some of the more popular ones like Marcus Borg and John Dominic Crossan tend to sell books to liberal Christian audiences, so I've always thought E.P. Sanders treatment was perferable. I'll spare you the links to scholars who identify as orthodox Christians, like Luke Timothy Johnson or N.T. Wright. It sounded like you specifically wanted more scholarly sources and not popular books, so you could just look at the scholarly journal dedicated to the study of the historical Jesus. Or the Jesus Seminar. Or either of the following Introductions to the New Testament textbooks which are used in secular universities throughout the english speaking world:

Introduction to the New Testament by Mark Allen Powell

Introduction to the New Testament by Bart Ehrman

These are the ones I'm personally most familiar with. There are tons more like Geza Vermes and Amy Jill Levine I haven't read and I'm not as familiar with.

But I'm not telling you anything you wouldn't learn in any basic 101 intro to New Testament Class. The academic consensus is that regardless of what you think about him as a religious figure, it is extremely likely that there was a first century Jew named Jesus who started a faith movement that led to him being crucified. Why do scholars think this? Because by the time Paul started writing his letters 20 years later there was a growing, spreading religious movement that worship a crucified Jew named Jesus as their messiah, and given critical analysis of the texts produced by this movement, some of which are now in the New Testament, there really doesn't exist a coherent argument for the development of this movement that doesn't include the existence of a first century Jew named Jesus who was crucified.

For a pretty comprehensive book on the how the Holy Spirit is taught throughout the Bible and has been viewed throughout the history of Church, your one-stop-shop is Anthony Thiselton's The Holy Spirit: In Biblical Teaching, through the Centuries, and Today. One comment has already addressed Dr. Gordon Fee, and he is another go to scholar for doctrine related to the Spirit. Any of his books or commentaries would be good.

For more accessible material, Billy Graham actually wrote a little book on the Holy Spirit serval years ago that is pretty straightforward and helpful. Also, Francis Chan and J.D. Greear have written more recent books on the Holy Spirit.

To better understand the spiritual gifts I would recommend the works of Wayne Grudem or Sam Storms, as well as D.A. Carson's exposition of 1 Corinthians 12 -14.

If you would like a sermon series to listen to, I found this podcast helpful.

I hope that helps!

I'm not familiar with specific Roman Catholic teachings on Heaven ... but I certainly wouldn't look to "Heaven is for Real" as a source of sound doctrine.

You could be running into some problems insofar as that where there isn't official RC dogma on a topic, people are allowed to hold a variety of interpretations and understandings.

It's also important to draw a distinction between heaven as God's current spiritual realm, and heaven as the ultimate stated of restored creation: a new Heaven and Earth.

You might find Peter Kreeft's book "Everything You Ever Wanted to Know About Heaven" helpful: http://www.amazon.com/Everything-Ever-Wanted-About-Heaven/dp/0898702976/

These are some of the better books I've accumulated in school:

• An Introduction to the New Testament - Raymond Brown. Exactly what the title says.
  
  
• The Early Church - Henry Chadwick. This is more of a historical overview of the development of the Church, etc.
  
  
• The Shape of Catholic Theology - Aiden Nichols. This book is kind of a dense read. Not gonna lie.
  
  
• At the Origin of the Christian Claim - Luigi Giussani.
  
  
• The Craft of Theology - Avery Dulles.
  
  
• The Theology of the Church - Charles Jornet. - This one is about ecclesiology, or the structure of the Church.
  
  
• Early Christian Fathers -Cyril Richardson. Includes primary sources like letters and homilies.
  
  
• The Trinitarian Crontroversy - William Rusch. Very good history of early heresies, like Arianism and Nestorianism, and how they pushed the Church to develop the Creed.
  
  
• Called to Communion - Joseph Ratzinger.
  
  
• Catholicism: Christ and the Common Destiny of Man - Henri de Lubac. This book is fantastic!
  
  
• The Meaning of Tradition - Yves Congar.
  
  
• Introduction to Moral Theology - Romanus Cessario.
  
  
• The Major Works -Anselm of Canterbury. Nice collection, see especially: Cur Deus Homo.
  
  
• On the Incarnation - Ignatius of Antioch. I LOVED this one!
  
  
• Credo for Today - Joseph Ratzinger. Basically anything by Ratzinger.

> See a problem with traditionalism and an authoritarian system like the Vatican?

That's not how the Magisterium works. Neo-conservative Catholics may act that way, but most of the things that come from the modern Vatican are not high level or authoritative. Proclaiming a "year of Darwin" for example doesn't mean I have to hold Darwin as some kind of saint or hero. It just means that the Pope and some people in the Vatican wanted to do that for whatever personal reason. But that action and others like it doesn't employ infallibility and they certainly do not have a gift of impeccability. Neo-Conservative Catholics like to defend the modern status quo even to the point of rejecting past teaching in favor of modern or novel ideas. But the principle that proper belief should be what was always and everywhere taught has been established long ago.

Humani Generis allowed for "research and discussion" but it did not accept evolution as doctrine or as more than a theory. Included in his call for research and discussion was to hear out both sides, which includes the "creationist" side, which simply states correctly that all of the Church Fathers believed in a literal interpretation of Genesis. Which really, is supported by Humani Generis in the sense that Humani Generis states that Adam and Eve were real people, and not only real people but the first couple.

I've summarized a number of sources in this thread.

A better explanation of magisterial authority can be found in Fr. Ripperger's book Magisterial Authority.

Here are a few of my favorite theologians, Bible scholars, and books

For Biblical exegesis

Inductive Bible Study by Robert Traina and David Bauer

For Systematic Theology

Classic Christianity: A Systematic Theology by Thomas C. Oden (Almost anything by Oden is good really)

For Pauline Studies

Paul and the Faithfulness of God by NT Wright

The Theology of Paul by James D. G. Dunn


For Cultural Background in New Testament

Craig S. Keener (his commentary on John's Gospel is phenomenal, as is the IVP Background commentary by him)

Ben Witherington III (his commentaries are generally good)

For Christian ethics

Moral Vision of the New Testament by Richard B. Hays

For Old Testament

Walter Brueggeman (pretty much anything by this guy)

Terrence Fretheim (I especially like his commentary on Exodus)

Sandra Richter (Epic of Eden, a good primer on ancient Israelite and Canaanite culture and how it shaped the OT)

Philosophy of Religion

Soren Kierkegaard (my absolute favorite philosopher, I especially recommend Fear and Trembling)

Thomas Aquinas

St. Augustine

Alvin Plantiga (I personally dislike Plantiga's philosophy, but he's become a big name in philosophy of Religion so not someone to be ignorant of)

William Hasker

William Abraham

Omnipotence and other Theological Mistakes by Charles Hartshorne (I'm not a process theologian, but this book in particular is highly important in modern theology, definitely worth a read)


Edit:
If you wanted a broad, general sweep of theology, I'd recommend The Modern Theologians by David F. Ford. It's a good overview of various theological movements since the start of the 20th century and covers theology from many different perspectives.

Not sure how helpful this will be, but you might point out that there's evolution and Christianity are not NECESSARILY incompatible, that's there's no real reason for him to be worried about evolution clashing with his faith in god. You could point out that many Christians do believe in Evolution. The Catholic Church actually endorses natural selection so any Catholic that denies evolution is actually committing blasphemy. Lutherans, Methodists, and many other Christian denominations see no inconsistency between believing in the Christian God and accepting evolution.

There's also several books you could point him to. Richard Dawkins's new book "The Greatest Show on Earth" http://www.amazon.com/Greatest-Show-Earth-Evidence-Evolution/dp/1416594787/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252038340&sr=1-2

surveys the evidence for evolution, so that would be a great book for your brother to read. Most Creationists demonize Dawkins, though, so your brother might not be receptive to that.

Michael Ruse, a Philosophy Professor at Florida State University, has written countless books on the history of Evolution, the debate between Creationists and Evolutionists, and the history of the conflict between Christianity and Science. Ruse, while an agnostic, IS sympathetic to Christianity, and your brother should find him less offensive to read than Dawkins.

http://www.amazon.com/Can-Darwinian-Christian-Relationship-Religion/dp/0521637163/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252038283&sr=8-2

http://www.amazon.com/Evolution-Creation-Struggle-Michael-Ruse/dp/0674022556/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252038283&sr=8-6

http://www.amazon.com/Darwinian-Revolution-Science-Tooth-Claw/dp/0226731693/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252038283&sr=8-13

Reading your responses, it seems like the major sticking point is your misconception that becoming a Christian means giving up the discoveries of science or modern cosmology. As a Christian, I'd like to emphasize that what you believe about the age of the universe or how we got here as a species has absolutely no bearing on your standing with God.

There are many arguments for the existence of God; William Lane Craig summarizes a few here. But I would ask you to zero in on the one argument that makes Christianity unique among world religions, and that is its foundation in an historical event: the resurrection of Jesus of Nazareth. If this one event never occurred, there is no basis for Christianity.

Fortunately for Christians, the historicity of the resurrection is well established. And you can arrive at this position without first accepting that the New Testament is infallible or inerrant. Gary Habermas is a well-known authority on the historicity of Jesus of Nazareth and the resurrection. You may be interested in starting with a book that captures a dialogue between him and atheist Antony Flew.

Whatever you conclude, please don't decide that something is true simply because you want it to be so. Truth is that which accurately describes reality, whether we like it or not. If in the interest of pleasing this girl you were to pretend that Christianity is true while believing it to be false, you may irreparably damage the relationship.

I can tell you, I grew up in a household that had this on the coffee table among other equally questionable literature. It wasn't until college that I began to read things like Harry Potter and enjoy shows like Family Guy.

Even then, neither of my parents were as controlling (or paranoid) of my actions as your mom is. Take some time to mull that comparison over.

I wish you godspeed and the best of luck, friend. You deserve to steer your own ship.

I certainly hope you get this message. As a missionary, I came across a great book that I think is exactly applicable to your needs. The title is Born That Way? and I think is a great resource for anyone struggling with their sexual identity in the LDS Church.

Also, come join us over in r/lds for some less liberal support :)

For me I'm going to go a bit old school. First "The Abolition of Man" by C. S. Lewis, which argues for a sort of 'Universal Truth'. I thought it was endlessly fascinating, and it's really an easy, short read. (The audio book was only an few hours long). There's also Lewis's "Mere Christianity" which is once again easy and short. In it he sort of starts with a shortened version of the argument found in Abolition, and from there discusses why Christianity itself works as the 'Universal Truth'.

If your looking for something thicker, I would suggest G. K. Chesterton's "Heretics", which blasts away the philosophy of his contemporaries (Which is still applicable today), "Orthodoxy" which discusses his own conversion and his own search for truth, and "The Everlasting Man" which discusses the history of mankind and Christianity's role in it. (This was also the book that converted Lewis' intellect).

Chesterton is not necessarily a difficult read because of lengthy words, or because he references something no longer fashionable, but because of his ideas. I like to think I can understand things fairly well, but I had to pause often to go over a phrase, or to really think about a thought he presented. But both authors are very enjoyable.

Hairsplitting or not, I am quite excitted that we have two new books on the Beatific Vision by leading Reformed theologians coming this year: Hans Boorsma's Seeing God and Mike Allen's Grounded in Heaven. Throw in Todd's new book Remembrance, Communion, and Hope (released today!) which I am told has a fair amount to say about it as well and it is a good year for reading about heaven.

I would start with the classic Some mistakes of Moses, by Robert Ingersoll.

There is a short book called Why There Is No God: Simple Responses to 20 Common Arguments for the Existence of God, by Armin Navabi, that is also a nice read.

One that I recently finished reading and enjoyed very much is The Foundational Falsehoods of Creationism, by Aron Ra. The book is not exactly about atheism; it's Aron's rebuttal to many creationist arguments, but Aron is a widely known atheist activist, and the book is very enjoyable.

I usually listen to The Thinking Atheist podcast, from Seth Andrews (a podcast I highly recommend, by the way). There are some book he suggested in his podcast that I haven't read yet, but which I included in my to-read list:

• A Manual for Creating Atheists, by Peter Boghossian.
  
• God: The Most Unpleasant Character in All Fiction, by Dan Barker.
  
• [The God Virus: How Religion Infects Our Lives and Culture] (https://www.amazon.com/God-Virus-Religion-Infects-Culture/dp/0970950519/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1486982921&sr=1-1&keywords=the+god+virus), by Darrel Ray.
  
• Sacred Cows: A Lighthearted Look at Belief and Tradition Around the World, by Seth Andrews himself.

If you’re interested in learning more about Radical Orthodoxy, I’d recommend Jamie Smith’s book Introducing Radical Orthodoxy. Smith is Reformed, and is not part of the RO movement but Milbank wrote the foreword.

I like a lot of the stuff the RO folks say, as well as the postliberals at Yale and Duke more broadly. Evangelicals would benefit greatly from reading them more.

Yeah, see I think your experience with Christianity left you bitter and I can understand that. There are lots of churches that are not so good.

I'm pretty sure I do understand the reality of being filled with the holy spirit, since I have studied it for over 10 years, and am part of a church which believes in the gifts of the Spirit. But we're also friends with people like John MacArthur who wrote "Charismatic Chaos", which is a welcome criticism of what was happening in many of the charismatic movements. BTW - John MacArthur, who is not charismatic at all would say that he is filled with the Spirit.

In Christianity, you can read whatever you want, there are no restrictions placed upon you by the church (or at least there shouldn't be).

Have you ever tried to make a deal with her where you read a book about the Charismatic church and spiritual warfare etc. and promise you will really consider it. Look for where it's true, and where it's false, and then she read a book like Charismatic Chaos, or something and promise to really consider whether it's biblical. Just a thought. You probably need to consider what is in Charismaticism that is profitable and what isn't.

Here are their top picks for each category:

​

Apologetics/Evangelism - Evangelism in a Skeptical World: How to Make the Unbelievable News About Jesus More Believable

​

Biblical Studies - Lexham Geographic Commentary on the Gospels

​

Children and Youth - The Friend Who Forgives

​

Christian Living/Discipleship - The Gospel Comes with a House Key: Practicing Radically Ordinary Hospitality in Our Post-Christian World

​

The Church/Pastoral Leadership - Preaching as Reminding: Stirring Memory in an Age of Forgetfulness

​

CT Women - Perfectly Human: Nine Months with Cerian

​

Culture and the Arts - Why Should the Devil Have All the Good Music?: Larry Norman and the Perils of Christian Rock

​

Fiction - An Extra Mile: A Story of Embracing God’s Call

​

History/Biography - The Spirit of Early Evangelicalism: True Religion in a Modern World

​

Missions/Global Church - Megachurch Christianity Reconsidered: Millennials and Social Change in African Perspective

​

Politics and Public Life - Scars Across Humanity: Understanding and Overcoming Violence Against Women

​

Spiritual Formation - Subversive Sabbath: The Surprising Power of Rest in a Nonstop World

​

Theology/Ethics - Seeing God: The Beatific Vision in Christian Tradition

We do, however, have to be critical of the type of witness Scripture gives us. The high Christological formulas we find in the gospels are the result of some development over the first decades after Christ's death. I say this to simply point out that statements like Thomas' shouldn't be misunderstood as implying the historical 12 disciples saw Jesus as 'homoousios' with the Father. The development of Christological and Trinitarian doctrines is a fascinating question that needs to take the historically mediated nature of revelation into account. The book I cited above is a great intro. Also, this book and this book are wonderful texts for further examination.

The Everlasting Man, if your friend can handle Chesterton at his best. Heretics if he cannot.

Welcome to the dark side ;)

Actually though, this is the question that got me interested in theology as a nonreligious person. And it's partner question can God make a square circle?

The argument I find most persuasive comes from C.S. Lewis's essay "Divine Omnipotence," and though it is not without faults, I'll present it briefly here: The reality is, what is "good" for one person is simultaneously "bad" for another. If God were to run around making everything good for everyone, we would live in a meaningless universe, constantly in flux, with no set rules or principles by which we could understand our surroundings. In order for our life to make sense, there have to be constant, set, principles by which the world is ordered. It's not a question of must evil exist, it is a question of how could it not, particularly in a world where humans have free will.

Might I suggest the book Omnipotence and Other Theological Mistakes

You are looking for Gnosis of the Cosmic Christ by Tau Malachi.

This is a thick book, both in the number of pages as well as the information contained on those pages. Been reading it on and off for a while now. Incredibly well explained Gnostic/Qabalistic version of Christianity/Magic. There are lots of Magical practices or tweaked Golden Dawn rituals being interpreted through a different lens.

This book helped me (truly) rid myself of my ex-Christian stigmas. I did not expect that going into it. Grasping the depth of the Christian tradition and showing the Qabalistic nature of the New Testament really helped me reach back out to some of my Evangelical family. We can say similar things, pray, talk about "how good God is", and etc., but our dictionary is just a little different. I am still a Magician with my own daily practices, but one with a little wider field of vision. We aren't so different.

Worth the read.

An atheist-Catholic conversation book you say?

Socrates meets Jesus by Peter Kreeft

http://www.amazon.com/Socrates-Meets-Jesus-Questioner-Confronts/dp/0830823387

And, since you are coming here asking for a book and not recommending one you have read before to your friend, I do hope you read the book first and think about it's points a bit so you can have a good discussion. No book bombing, m'kay? :D

I would start with

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9_o7NGTkJc

and/or

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JEFy-ZtEzg

That's Spike Psarris. For all I know, he may not even know the philosophy behind presuppostionalism. If so then he is just doing it organically. He just takes naturalistic observations and carries them to their logical conclusions.

If that floats your boat then I would go one of two ways:

You could check out

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEOY4LNRMd8

for the more pedestrian version of presuppostitionalism... Or you could go all in and check out

https://www.amazon.com/Christian-Apologetics-Cornelius-Van-Til/dp/0875525113

for the more ivory tower intellectual variety.

The choice is yours between those two. It's just whatever fits your personality better.

---

Posted by: p**p

I would start with

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9_o7NGTkJc

and/or

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JEFy-ZtEzg

That's Spike Psarris. For all I know, he may not even know the philosophy behind presuppostionalism. If so then he is just doing it organically. He just takes naturalistic observations and carries them to their logical conclusions.

If that floats your boat then I would go one of two ways:

You could check out

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEOY4LNRMd8

for the more pedestrian version of presuppostitionalism... Or you could go all in and check out

https://www.amazon.com/Christian-Apologetics-Cornelius-Van-Til/dp/0875525113

for the more ivory tower intellectual variety.

The choice is yours between those two. It's just whatever fits your personality better.

> Darwinism

It's a common term used by everybody. Richard Dawkins uses it: "Darwinism encourages precisely the opposite values." Likewise, Leading French biologist Didier Raoult wrote a paper titled The post-Darwinist rhizome of life.
Prominent agnostic atheist philosopher Michael Ruse wrote papers titled Darwinism defended and Darwinism and its Discontents, as well as Can a Darwinian be a Christian?.

First, it's ok that you aren't up to speed. It isn't your fault.

The book I recommend is Foundational Falsehoods of Creationism by Aron Ra. He explains what evolution really is and why/how creationists get it wrong. I listened to it on audiobook and it was superb.

Heck out the following
A Travel Guide to Heaven: 10th Anniversary Edition by Anthony Destafano

And

Thirty-five FAQs About Eternity

And

Everything You Ever Wanted to Know About Heaven by Peter Kreeft

What ARE the 14 things witches hope parents never find out? https://www.amazon.com/Fourteen-Things-Witches-Parents-Never/dp/1879366754

This title is so good, it almost makes me want to read the book.

1. Harry Potter was based on reality and JK Rowling is the Head Witch
   
2. Incense and pink quartz are the gateway drugs to naked Satan worshipping
   
3. • 14. ???

The Historical Jesus in Context. It's a collection of articles edited by Amy Jill-Levine, dale Allison and John Dominic Crossan. The articles give a fairly comprehensive overview of the historical, cultural, archaeological and literary context of Christian origins with contributions from several scholars including (in addition to Jill-Levine, Crossan and Allison), Dale Evans, John Kloppenburg, Jonathan Reed, Bruce Chilton, Ben Witherington and several other less known ones. This is really more for popular audiences than for scholars but it's a good introduction to a wide variety contextual perspectives.

Not really current as it's from the 90s but this is the book my physics teacher gave me that got me well & truly hooked:

Fire In The Mind

It's not on kindle yet but you should give this book a proper read for a good understanding of Magisterial Authority (i.e. what is infallible, when is a council or pope infallible, ect.)

Magisterial Authority by Fr. Ripperger

If you want I can scan you a few chapters and send them to you when I am not at work.

If you want a good history of philosophy with responses to basically everybody, Fr. Frederick Copleston's A History of Philosophy is pretty good.

Here's the first volume: https://www.amazon.com/History-Philosophy-Vol-Pre-Socratics-Plotinus/dp/0385468431/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1543579301&sr=8-4&keywords=frederick+copleston

Edward Feser deals with both the New Atheists, Enlightenment thinkers, and Old Atheists in The Last Superstition, Aquinas, and Neo-Scholastic Essays. Fr. Garrigou Lagrange's Reality is also worth it.

The Last Superstition: https://www.amazon.com/Last-Superstition-Refutation-New-Atheism-ebook/dp/B00D40EGCQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1543579343&sr=8-1&keywords=the+last+superstition

Aquinas: https://www.amazon.com/Aquinas-Beginners-Guide-Edward-Feser/dp/1851686908/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1543579366&sr=8-6

Neo-Scholastic Essays: https://www.amazon.com/Neo-Scholastic-Essays-Edward-Feser/dp/1587315580/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1543579366&sr=8-5&keywords=edward+feser

Reality: https://www.amazon.com/Reality-Synthesis-Reginald-Garrigou-Lagrange-P/dp/1477582401/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1543579439&sr=8-1&keywords=reality+garrigou-lagrange

Honestly, I tend to think Van Til's Presuppositionalism is a better system than a lot of Catholic philosophy. His book Christian Apologetics is probably his easiest to read, though I'll admit I've had more access to his ideas from his defenders than his actual writing: https://www.amazon.com/Christian-Apologetics-Cornelius-Van-Til/dp/0875525113/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1543579550&sr=8-1&keywords=christian+apologetics+van+til

In a less theologically charged but similar category are Alvin Plantinga's Where the Conflict Really Lies and Warranted Christian Belief: https://www.amazon.com/Where-Conflict-Really-Lies-Naturalism-ebook/dp/B005X3SAHY/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1543579615&sr=8-1&keywords=where+the+conflict+really+lies+science%2C+religion%2C+and+naturalism

https://www.amazon.com/Warranted-Christian-Belief-Alvin-Plantinga-ebook/dp/B0059EQ4DY/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1543579634&sr=8-1&keywords=warranted+christian+belief

A link to the book Darwin's Pious Idea: Why the Ultra-Darwinists and Creationists Both Get It Wrong for anyone who might be interested in reviews of the book.

Darwin's Pious Idea by Conor Cunningham is very good, although it approaches the topic through biology, not physics.

Other books people might be interested in that deal with this reconciliation:

Finding Darwin's God, by Brown University cell biologist Kenneth Miller (for a scientific perspective)

Darwin's Pious Idea by Conor Cunningham (For a theological perspective)

SECTION | CONTENT

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Title | Putting Creation to the Test. Dr. Hugh Ross and Dr. Fuz Rana at Purdue University
Description | Follow RTB_Official for updates! Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/RTBofficial Twitter: https://twitter.com/RTB_official Instagram: http://instagram.com/rtb_official Website: http://www.reasons.org
Length | 2:33:38


SECTION | CONTENT

--|:--
Title | Has God Spoken? EVIDENCE FOR THE BIBLE pt1
Description | How could you prove that God has communicated to us? What would be a reasonable way to show that God has spoken? This video answers that question and deals with false prophecies in preparation for the next video in this series where we will begin to look at fulfilled prophecy in the Bible as proof that God has spoken. Full "Evidence for the Bible" playlist here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjnwldgqN8c&list=PLZ3iRMLYFlHuhA0RPKZFHVcjIMN_-F596 LINK to video about EVIDENCE for the Resurrection...
Length | 0:49:30


SECTION | CONTENT

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Title | The Resurrection Meets Skepticism - Gary Habermas, PhD
Description | Pomona First Baptist Church (February 22, 2015) - Lecture by Christian scholar and thinker Gary Habermas. Buy his books dealing with the evidence and arguments for the resurrection of Jesus of Nazareth: The Case for the Resurrection of Jesus: http://www.amazon.com/Case-Resurrection-Jesus-Gary-Habermas/dp/0825427886 Did the Resurrection Happen?: A Conversation with Gary Habermas and Antony Flew: http://www.amazon.com/Did-Resurrection-Happen-Conversation-Habermas/dp/0830837183 The Historical Je...
Length | 0:48:10


SECTION | CONTENT

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Title | Evidence for the Resurrection | Mike Licona, PhD
Description | Faith Bible Church (October 2012) - Lecture by Mike Licona. This video is part of the 'Reasons Conference' playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL-0zpu2toenZdKk7tuw3LUklHA1cvtNIA Author Bio: Michael R. Licona, Ph.D. in New Testament Studies (University of Pretoria), which he completed with distinction. He serves as external research collaborator at North-West University (Potchefstroom). Mike was interviewed by Lee Strobel in his book The Case for the Real Jesus and appeared in Strobe...
Length | 0:50:46


SECTION | CONTENT

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Title | Dr. Gary Habermas - Near Death Experiences
Description | Dr. Gary Habermas gives a Tactical Faith Lecture on the validity of near death experiences as possible proof against naturalism. Lecture was given at Southeastern Bible College.
Length | 0:57:54






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Because its what Christ promised us, during his mission on Earth.

Because it makes sense in the context of scripture.

Because it is reasonable to believe based on our theories of the soul.

I mean there's books on this stuff and there are plenty of online resources about this stuff. Which goes into detail.

I would check out this book from amazon. It sounds like exactly what your looking for. http://www.amazon.ca/Darwins-Pious-Idea-Ultra-Darwinists-Creationists/dp/0802848389 It's essentially about how God and evolution can make sense.

I for one struggle with contraction in that in Genesis, death did not exist before the fall of man. Yet God would have to have used death to use evolution as a tool for creating life on earth. I have not read the above book but would like to on my Kindle in the near future.

This link should explain:

http://skeptico.blogs.com/skeptico/2006/06/equivocation.html

There's also the PRATT list by AronRa (specifically the second one, fallacy of false equivalence)

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXJ4dsU0oGMKnaxEzgOPup9WKlNPZwiJN

And, if you want more depth and arguments against religion in general i'd recommend : The foundational falsehoods of creationism :

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL126AFB53A6F002CC

(also available in book form)

https://www.amazon.com/Foundational-Falsehoods-Creationism-Aron-Ra/dp/1634310780

> a mass forever

Yes but without guitars.

Try this: www.amazon.com/Everything-Wanted-Heaven---Dreamed-Asking/dp/0898702976/

The Christological Controversy, an anthology of both orthodox and heretical primary sources. (There is another volume on The Trinitarian Controversy.)

RCIA is a formality. You should seek authentic Catholic teaching in sermons, books and saints.

https://www.youtube.com/user/onearmsteve4192/search?query=anything
https://www.amazon.com/Heretics-G-K-Chesterton/dp/1449599435
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=af6a6x87F5Y

I haven't read it but this book by James K.A. Smith seems just what you're looking for.

I think part of the problem nowadays is a lack of understanding on the heirarchy of the levels of magisterial teaching and the assent we have to give to various teaching.

Truth cannot contradict truth and we must always base our understanding of things on first principles. The teachings of the doctors of the church and specifically St.thomas aquinas are of a higher import than other theologians.

The magisterium of the church has itself given a higher place to The teaching of St. Thomas especially and also St. Alphonsus as he is the doctor of moral theology.

I think if everyone read the following two books it would help tremendously in our understanding of how the Tradition of the church and the binding force of the various levels of the magisterium.

http://www.amazon.com/Binding-Force-Tradition-Chad-Ripperger/dp/0615785557

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1503022420/ref=pd_aw_sim_b_1?refRID=173BEEXXM4JP875HHD5W

I cannot recommend Fr. Ripperger enough, these works are fairly short but full of numerous footnotes to further investigate the sources.

The simple answer is Skeptics Annotated Bible as far as spotting contradictions to know beyond any doubts that the Bible is one giant fairy tale.

If you want to go further, also recommend:

Aron Ra Foundational Falsehoods of Creationism For a preview of Aron Ra Biblical Absurdity

Bart Ehrman Forged: Writing in the name of God

There's also this fabulous presentation by Richard Carrier: Did Jesus Even Exist?

> Where? I could have missed it, it's true. They put out a good amount of vids. But I see no acknowledgment of failure, or responsibilities, of the clergy. Clergy responsibilities are regarded as 'Church' responsibilities, spoken of in terms of "we/us". Laity responsibilities are spoken of in singling out the laity.

Fr. Ripperger literally wrote a book about the problems created by the hierarchy and their poor management of authority. Its called Magisterial Authority.

He also wrote a rather well-known piece (at least, among trads around here) about the difference between 'conservative' and 'traditional' Catholicism.

Further, his book The Binding Force of Tradition touches on the duties of the hierarchy. I'm sure there is more out there. Suffice it to say, Fr. Ripperger isn't one of the priests guilty of ignoring the problems in the Church - which is one of the reasons why I'd give more weight to his criticism of the traditional movement than any random speaker.

> When it's good advice, yes. But here's an ongoing problem with Christians: they mistake masochism for humility. To the point where criticisms of their faults is taken as, by default, true.

I agree with you - it is a mistake to take any criticism as truth without examining it, as is often the case when the world criticizes the faith or the Church to modern Catholics. But I see the opposite problem in the case of many fellow trads, where criticism is brushed off without examining it and praying/meditating about. Perhaps this isn't an issue elsewhere?

Well I'll explain the difference or at least try to.
Government you have two options
Do it (some legal mandate) or end up in jail (forcefully imprison you do to your actions)

Do it (some none legal mandate but rather teaching such as 5+5=10) or end up in hell (willfully by choice as a result of free will)

Catholic teaching is that you have free will but naturally there are consequences from them. You live a life where you have free will, the ability to choose, to generally form yourself as a morally good person or bad person. Now when you die you have made a choice through your actions. The choice you have made is directly heaven or hell.

Why is this the case? Well where else would you go? Your soul lives on there cannot be annihilation just like matter can't be destroyed (comparison I'm sure some quantum something or other says it can...). You soul can go to heaven and share in the beatific vision or not. To a person who has formed their life in rejection of god (through bad actions) this would hardly be something desired to share eternally being close to that which you reject. But you're then left with the other choice, that which all those who reject god go. This place is called hell.

On several theories of how hell's punishment is and isn't. In the bible hell is spoken to as a fire in Jesus' teachings but it is also warned that the punishment is much worse then physical fire. So what is it? Some theologians have theorized, as CS Lewis put it

“All your life an unattainable ecstasy has hovered just beyond the grasp of your consciousness. The day is coming when you will wake to find, beyond all hope, that you have attained it, or else, that it was within your reach and you have lost it forever.”
― C.S. Lewis, The Problem of Pain


Others have given the theory that there is only heaven, there is no other 'place' to go but that the heaven or hell choice comes from the state of the individual. For those who rejected god it is a pain, seeing their creator causes them pain for in their hearts they hate him.

Here is some more if you want to read up on it

http://www.peterkreeft.com/topics/heaven.htm
http://www.peterkreeft.com/topics/hell.htm
http://www.amazon.com/Everything-Wanted-Heaven-Dreamed-Asking/dp/0898702976
http://www.amazon.com/Heaven-Hearts-Deepest-Longing-Kreeft/dp/0898702283/ref=pd_sim_b_1
http://www.amazon.com/Making-Sense-Suffering-Peter-Kreeft/dp/0892832193/ref=pd_sim_b_2