Autogenerated.

Discussion Megathread: Leah Remini A&E Special + AMA Announcement for Cedars and Steve Hassan!

The long-awaited special will be airing at 9PM ET/PT on Tuesday November 13th, 2018. It will air on the cable channel A&E in the US.

We'll be trying to keep this post up to date with links/details on how to watch Leah's A&E expose as we get them in, so please comment below if you know of a way to watch that isn't listed.

• Here is the Trailer/Discussion of that Trailer.
  
• Here is Who Will be on the Panel
  
  Do you want to Thank Leah? Do that here! A few Folks are organizing a Twitter Storm to thank Leah on November 14, which you can read all about here, or see u/patlynnw:
  
  ​
  
  Watch in Canada on Optik/Teleus
  
  How to Watch in the UK Sun Nov 18th, 7pm
  
  (Possibly) Watch Online, after the fact:
  
  
• The A&E Website
  
• Hulu
  
• Amazon Prime
  
• You can also try your luck with the A&E App.
  
  ​
  
  

  Special AMA Details!!
  

  
  To ease your cult expose hangover, we will also be hosting TWO Special AMAs. Please give a massive thanks to both Cedars and Steve Hassan who have reached out and accepted our AMA invitations! Here is when all that is going down:
  
  ​
  
  Cedars, AKA the inimitable Lloyd Evans- Friday November 16th, 2018. Starting 8AMEST for appx. 24 hours.
  
  Guys, it's Cedars!! Join us as we offer the chance to Q&A one of the most prominent activists in the EXJW community. Lloyd is best known as the Founder of JW Survey and the John Cedars Channel He has also recently authored a book, which is part of a greater wave that is making public the struggles of those in the EXJW community. Lloyd, if I've missed anything (as I am sure I have), let me know. :) For the rest of you, watch this space for the sticky, where you will be able to ask your quesetions!
  
  ​
  
  Steve Hassan- Monday November 19th, 2018. 9AM EST, for appx 24 Hours.
  
  Let's have a round of applause for everyone's favorite cult deprogramming expert! Steve Hassan is the founder of Freedom of Mind, and a leading figure in the movement to define how cults operate and combat their effects. His book "Combating Cult Mind Control" is a cult favorite (no pun intended) among EXJWs and will be having its 30th anniversary this week. Here is an excerpt from his website, with more information:
  
  >"Steven has helped thousands of former cult members and their families, clergy, psychologists and fellow cult experts over the years. He co-developed “Ending the Game”, a non-coercive curriculum designed to educate and empower commercial sex trafficking victims, and has spoken out about the effects, mechanisms, and signs of undue influence in its many forms on 60 Minutes, CNN, NPR, Good Morning America, The Today Show, Larry King Live, Oprah, and many other programs, as well as being featured in People Magazine, USA Today, Newsweek, The New York Times, The Washington Post, The Wall Street Journal, Chicago Tribune, The Guardian, and dozens of other major publications and websites."
  
  Watch "Hot" sort for the sticky next Monday where you can ask Steve whatever you'd like! You won't want to miss this chance.
  
  ​
  
  PS- Sorry we had to clump it all together. Reddit only gives us two stickys.
  
  ​
  
  
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  IamAbot_v01. Alpha version. Under care of /u/oppon.
  Comment 1 of 1
  Updated at 2018-11-12 08:24:51.091331
  
  Next update in approximately 20 mins at 2018-11-12 08:44:51.091368

I'm not going to be objective, but I will try to be graceful.

Jehovah's Witnesses believe in their interpretation of their "translation" of the Bible as delivered through the current the literature that they buy and sell from the Governing Body of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society. Like other groups with roots in 19th century American Restoration Movement, they have a underlining presupposition the mainstream Christianity diverged from the truth of the Bible back in the days of early Roman Catholicism. They might say that the Reformation was a move in the right direction, away from the Pope and his demonically inspired organization, but they will deny just about every aspect of orthodoxy that isn't undeniably obvious.

JWs do not believe in the Trinity; it is a doctrine that they believe has pagan roots and is intrinsically polytheistic. Nevertheless, they believe that Jesus is a god, but not the God Jehovah. They believe that the Holy Spirit is merely the finger of God and not a distinct divine person.

JWs do not believe that people have immortal souls. They believe that one's spirit is simply one's breath.They believe that when a person dies, they are annihilated. God may choose to recreate anyone from His memory which is what he did with Jesus after his death. They do not believe that Jesus was resurrected as a physical man (except for when he had to demonstrate to his disciples that he was alive). They do not believe in the Ascension.

JWs do not believe in hell. They do not believe in Christ's sacrificial atonement. Christ is merely the first and most obedient creature that God created and is therefore our greatest example. They (currently) believe that only a very select group of believers will ever go to heaven. Most of humanity will be recreated from God's memory to repopulate a new earth. Those who did not offend God directly or join Satan's organization (the Roman Catholic Church) will be permitted to live in happiness whether or not they ever trusted in Jesus.

Jehovah's Witnesses don't believe that Jesus died on a cross; he was nailed to a stake. They do not believe that God is out right more powerful than the Devil. They very likely believe that Jesus has already returned invisibly and that he is guiding the Governing Body of the Watch Tower and judging Christian churches around the globe.

Active JW missionaries are called publishers. They are heavily encouraged to study and distribute Watch Tower literature. They buy enough tracts and pamphlets to give away to whoever will take them with their own money. That money goes back to the Watch Tower B&T Society for them to print more books, pay staff (including the Governing Body), purchase and maintain property, and other organizational expenses. The materials in the literature is subject to change. Beyond certain points in the history of Jehovah's Witnesses, you will find no publicly available physical literature that the Society has recalled. Ostensibly, that recalled literature will be made available digitally in unedited form (ostensibly).

JW churches are called Meeting Halls and their services are called meetings. Meetings are held several nights a week. It is in these meetings that the latest Watch Tower literature is discussed and their more systematic doctrines taught. One basic understanding that JWs have is that the Bible without the light of the Watch Tower is very easy to misunderstand. Nevertheless,I must admit that they spend more time memorizing (Watch Tower exegeted) scripture than I do.

There is much more about Jehovah's Witnesses to say, but I'll stop here before typos overwhelm me. I haven't even discussed their Bible or mentioned theocratic warfare.


Sources:
http://freeminds.org
Crisis of Conscience by Raymond Franz
30 Years A Watchtower Slave by William J Schnell
Kingdom of the Cults by Walter Martin
working with and befriending current, former, and disfellowshipped (excommunicated) JWs.

Besides Combating Cult Mind Control, Crisis of Conscious and The God Delusion (The trinity of exjw books? :D) a great book is "Why Evolution is True" by Jerry Coyne, it cleared up some misconceptions I had on evolution even after researching it. Also enjoyed the explanation on why there are some gaps in the fossil record as well, but overall it really solidified the fact that evolution has enormous irrefutable evidence backing its explanation.

"A Universe From Nothing" by Lawrence Krauss, explains the big bang and the physics of empty space. There is always something rather than nothing and basically the universe had to exist with the properties it does or otherwise it couldn't. (lol I promise im not celebrating 4/20) He did not do a very good job of explaining some of the physics principles in layman's terms so reading another introductory physics book would probably be best. I read "The Elegant Universe" by Brian Greene before and was still scratching my head a few times... but that might just be my own ineptitude.

"Beyond Religion - Ethics For A Whole World" by the Dali Lama. It was refreshing to read a book by a spiritual leader that actually gets the bigger picture. He talks about where ethics come from, why all people despite their background can be morally upright and that one does not need to be religiously inclined to lead an ethical, happy life that contributes to society. Mainly its a call for understanding and tolerance of others. I plan on sharing with my witness parents and friends to help them escape their narrow minded point of view that atheists and other non witnesses are heathens while respecting their religion... as much as I disagree.

I keep hearing A History of God brought up and Jesus Misquoted so they are next on my book list. I had started on the demon haunted world but have not finished it yet. Also, has anyone read this book yet...

http://www.amazon.com/The-Orwellian-World-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0802065457

Stumbled upon it the other day and thought it looked a little wacky but might be an entertaining read comparing 1984 to witnesses.

P.S. - Here is a shameless plug for the /r/atheism reading list...

http://www.reddit.com/help/faqs/atheism#RecommendedReading

Maybe we should start our own on the side bar. :)

Reading Ray Franz's book opened my eyes and I'll be forever grateful to that dear man. Here it is, it was just re-released this week! It's quickly sold out but will be in stock very soon.

Reading your post made my heart glad, and you can take a deep breath, you will be fine. The fact that you're here now shows you've already taken the first big step in getting your freedom.

I was in your shoes 2 years ago and i still can remember the incredible relief that I felt when I realized Armageddon is made up, they just use it to control the rank and file, identical to the Catholics and their fearmongering about Hell.

Reasearch! Research! Research, the King and his Kingdom!

In research you will find your freedom. It's better to be slapped with the truth than kissed with a lie.

>The copy of Crisis of Conscience that I have is a first edition hardcover. I see that there are many revisions of this work. What has changed between the first edition and the fifth edition?

I just gave a 1st edition to another redditor on here, & have a 4th edition in my possession.

And now I can't find any sort of preview of the 1st edition online...

In my copy, there are black-&-white photos in a few of the early chapters. As I recall, the 1st edition lacked those. Also, the last part of the book has a 13th chapter entitled "Perspective". Looking at the dates of his comments in that chapter, I see that many took place well past the original printing's date of 1983. So likely much of that chapter (which contains an overview, plus comments on developments within the Watchtower Society during the 1990's & into the early 2000's) focuses on developments subsequent to the 1st (2nd & 3rd) printings.

>I may have misread things (and it's certainly possible since I'm unfamiliar with both the New Testament and JW-isms), but Ray seems to write about the pre-1975 era of his time in the organization with great fondness.

I did not get that impression at all. From chapter 7 "Predictions and Presumption" [page 172] through chapter 9 "1975: 'The Appropriate Time for God to Act'," [page 253], Ray Franz dissects the origins of their multiple false prophecies and the hubris of the Watchtower Society's claims surrounding their biggest prophecy (and failure) of 1975.

The next chapter, [chapter 10] "1914 and 'This Generation'," discusses the fallout from the failed false prophecy of 1975 & subsequent structural changes within the organization.

But the only time I ever perceived Ray Franz as having any positive feelings towards anything associated with the Watchtower Society, was when he spoke of individual members who had served faithfully, and were then cast aside like trash by the very organization they'd served so long & loyally. Undoubtedly he was feeling quite a bit of that betrayal in his own situation.

I did a brief analysis of Raymond Franz' possible motivations in this thread, in case you're interested:

https://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/4bpk39/ray_franz_departure_from_watchtower_society/

I don't think he had much nostalgia for the earlier years of Knorr (who served under Rutherford, who was a terrible bully), or for the period of the initial Governing Body.

>What are some other books that you would recommend? I'm not really familiar with the ex-JW literary landscape.

There are dozens (if not more) books written about the JWs. I personally would recommend:

http://www.amazon.com/Orwellian-World-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0802065457

Haven't read this one yet, but it looks fascinating:

http://www.amazon.com/Judgment-Day-Must-Wait-Witnesses/dp/1936411237

http://www.amazon.com/Apocalypse-Delayed-Story-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0802079733

That should get you started...

>4) What happened between Ray and the rest of his family? There is almost no mention of Fred Franz after the inquisition started - did they ever communicate with each other after it began or did Fred never speak to him again after they started becoming suspicious of Ray?

As I recall, "Fractured Freddie" (my nickname for that idiot) Franz never spoke to his nephew after the witch-hunt began at Bethel. Nor did ol' "Fractured Freddie" (who allegedly talked to his shoes, later in life) apparently lift a finger to help his beleaguered nephew at any point during that witch-hunt.

Good! It's impossible NOT to see parallels between the JW world and that Orwellian dystopia (there's a book you might like: The Orwellian World of Jehovah's Witnesses

I too learned to be very good at doublethink. Took me almost two years after I was free, mentally, to be free physically - because I still lived at home. My online exJW friends were instrumental in helping me get through that time. Be patient, smile and nod, and lean on us. :-)

Hi there. I was born & raised JW. 37 years. At 19 whilst i was disfellowshipped i married an unbeliever. Then l was reinstated 11 months later. My husband never became a believer but supported me & our 2 kids in it. We rarely were invited to gatherings & no Brothers ever reached out to my husband like is encouraged in the publications. We always felt like outsiders. I voiced to my mother over & over that something was wrong i just couldn’t put my finger on it. And then it happened. I found out why.
Here is my letter i wrote my JW Family & friends.
https://www.bcbpa.com/anonymous-canada

Your gonna wanna watch this court footage. It happened in the summer of 2015

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCZ6rs9OvQLaoydMR6GjsqQ

Here is the link to the only ever Governing Body member to wake up and leave
https://www.amazon.ca/Crisis-Conscience-struggle-between-religion/dp/0999499211/ref=asc_df_0999499211/?tag=googlemobshop-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=293003641842&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=218145622079509894&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9001283&hvtargid=pla-434348371353&psc=1


Here is his interview

https://youtu.be/iK3F9hBcy2M

Here is the actual JW history

https://youtu.be/VE3zp9FiyiQ

I was in a similar situation as you. I won't try to guess your current views on the Watchtower organization, but let me share my experience.

For two years I was disfellowshipped, but still believed it was The Truth. We have a special acronym for this over at r/exjw - POMI (Physically Out, Mentally In). It is not a good situation. You try to lead a normal life, but deep down you feel deeply guilty and unworthy, convinced that, when Armageddon comes, God will personally destroy you for turning your back on Him. It's virtually impossible to do anything meaningful with your life when you live with this burden.

Fortunately, after 2 years I gave myself permission to research my faith.... actual research. I read Crisis of Conscience. I visited JW Facts. I soon realized that, it wasn't all "apostate lies" like I had been warned. Rather, I had been lied to by the Governing Body my entire life. I really can't put into words how joyful it is to be set free from Watchtower guilt.

My point is this: There is life after Watchtower. And it's more rewarding and satisfying than I could have ever imagined.

I am so sorry that this is happening to you. You are right to be concerned - this could very easily tear your family apart. I have seen it happen firsthand when someone in my family was recruited into the Dubs then became totally alienated from her non-Dub husband. You could very easily end up in a situation where both your wife and your child are brainwashed into thinking you are a bad influence and that only other Dubs are worth spending time with. You definitely do not want to be complacent about this. The JWs are not "just another religion". It is a very dangerous and nasty cult.

My advice would be to immediately start "studying" the JWs yourself - but NOT with their own material. JWs don't know their own history very well at all, but you can find a lot of eye opening stuff using outside materials like http://www.jwfacts.com

Here are the three books that I would strongly recommend you purchase and start reading right away:

The Reluctant Apostate: Leaving the Jehovah's Witnesses (a very long and well-researched explanation of the JWs - if you can only read one of these books, I would make it this one)

Combating Cult Mind Control (not focused on just the JWs, but a general book about how cults operate and how to try to work with someone to get them out)

Crisis of Conscience (an older book written by one of the "Governing Body" members that ended up leaving the religion)

If you read those books, you will learn a LOT about how the JWs operate and have ample proof that this is not a legitimate religion. However, you can't confront her directly with this info. She has been programmed by the cult to reject any direct attack on the religion.
However, as you read them, you will probably think of some questions that you'll have for your wife about the Dubs. Start asking her questions NOT in an aggressive way but just in a "curious" sort of way. For example, "What do you make of [this thing]? What is the JW explanation for that?"

When people are being brainwashed, you can't confront them directly about it. That just makes them dig their heels in. You have to slowly dismantle the belief system by asking them questions and forcing them to realize for themselves that the cult doesn't have a good answer for it.

I also recommend trying your best to find excuses to spend time away from home on meeting days to keep her away from the dubs as much as possible. Time spent away from the indoctrination sessions can often help people realize on their own that it is bullshit.

Where to begin?! Lol welcome.

At this point there’s quite a few ways to disbelieve the JW doctrine. Many people will fill you in I’m sure and debate over doubts here within the comment section. If you were really interested in knowing. I’d suggest:

John Cedars

Start from the very beginning if you’d like to view all the doubts via video format. There’s a lot of substance within that channel so I’d def start there. If your into podcasts I’d suggest:

This JW Life

Shunned

The Prodigal Boys

The Daily Dose

Book References:

Crisis Of Conscience

The Reluctant Apostate

Combating With Cult Mind Control

The usual recommended reading is Ray Franz' Crisis of Conscious. Ray Franz was a member of the Governing Body (JW's Corporate overlords) who basically defected and was "disfellowshipped" (excommunicated). You might have trouble finding it in bookstores though, since the copyright holders are refusing to publish for one reason or another [insert conspiracy theory here]. It can be found in PDF form online though.

Available on Amazon is The Reluctant Apostate by Lloyd Evans. He also runs a very informative and even handed (IMHO) YouTube channel under the name "John Cedars".

Lloyd's book was a very emotional read for me because a lot of the stuff that happened to him happened to me. Not everyone is can escape a cult, and those that do have irreversible damage done to their personality and psyche. Everyday is a struggle for me, but knowing that there are other exJW's make the pain bearable.

Knowing that exJW's and exMormon's have so many similarities give me even greater strength to keep going on. Thank you for existing and I hope that we all find our happiness.

side note: Tapirs, amirte? lol

edit: forgot a link

I never managed to get into the second book, but I think you've inspired me to do so. Read CoC, am in the middle of The Reluctant Apostate at the moment (can be found here: http://amzn.to/2rd25ye ) ... but I will give 'In Search of Christian Freedom' a read very soon.

Thank you.

That's interesting that you've heard that because the way I understood the 144 000 was that they were selected arbitrarily by God. If you were in a Kingdom Hall and there was someone who was particularly kind and saintly, everyone in the congregation would start to think that they were one of the elect. As one of the elect, they get respect, special privilege, and they are the only ones who can take communion (everyone else just passes the bread and grape juice because they aren't elect and, therefore, cannot partake in the sacrament).

Granted, I don't know what your source is, but I got this from a memoir by an ex-JW called I'm Perfect, You're Doomed. I don't know how libelous it may or may not be as the author is very, very bitter about her upbringing but the insider knowledge of a tradition is better than any armchair sources.

Yes there are! I enjoyed them all, I found them all on amazon for under $10-$15.
Some of my favorites are:

• How to rescue your loved one from the Watchtower
  
  
• Reasoning from the Scriptures with the Jehovah's Witnesses
  
  
• Jehovah's Witnesses Answered Verse by Verse
  
  There are a few others but I can't remember the name off the top of my head, just type JWs into amazon and shit ton pops up. And if you want a laugh, some JWs left comments on some of the books angry about their existence and they were hilarious to me.
  
  Edit:added some and changed formatting

For fun and a few laughs read [I'm perfect You're Doomed]
(http://www.amazon.com/Im-Perfect-Youre-Doomed-Upbringing/dp/1416556842)
Link is Amazon.

Of course!

This was amazingly helpful to me: https://oyc.yale.edu/religious-studies

Teaches you the history and context behind the Hebrew Bible and Greek Scriptures. It’s a great intro to a deeper look at the Bible. I learned so much from those two courses. They are pretty long, but well worth it.

Then I would recommend checking out Bart D Erhman’s books. He has a few lectures on audible and YouTube.

Also, I highly recommend reading Ray Franz’s book Crisis of Conscience. He was a Governing Body member in the 70s/80s who left and wrote an autobiography about his experiences. It’s mind blowing.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0999499211/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1522373103&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=crisis+of+conscience+by+raymond+franz

> How could you convince a group of people of something so fucked up?

Captives of a Concept is a good read.

http://captivesofaconcept.com/

(A link to the Amazon book just 'cause that website is just so diabolically bad:

http://www.amazon.com/Captives-Concept-Anatomy-Illusion-Cameron/dp/1411622103)

Good summary of the organisation's position (blood and some other medical bits) is here:

http://www.caic.org.au/jws/medical/blood3.htm

I have the feeling that there is some content out there somewhere which makes it clear some of the basis for the decision to introduce this ruling and it wasn't necessarily just scriptural (the scripture supported their intent). I'll have to search more for something along those lines.

But, anyway, agreed. It's a absolute going beyond what the bible really says and these guys are guilty of the deaths of those who refuse appropriate treatment because of their stand on this.

James Penton has written a couple of excellent books:

https://www.amazon.ca/Jehovahs-Witnesses-Third-Reich-Persecution/dp/0802089275

https://www.amazon.ca/Apocalypse-Delayed-Story-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0802079733

And for Orwellian fans, Gary and Heather Botting's book is a classic:

https://www.amazon.ca/Orwellian-World-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0802065457

Botting also has some great research published about the WTs legal history. Check his website for more.

Edit to add: all of the above books should be available for borrow through the public library system

Here's some books I've found that I think help explain the JW experience. Your library system might have some of these.

Jehovah's Witnesses: Portrait of a Contemporary Religious Movement A sociological study on the religion. Holden gets some doctrines wrong, but I think that's minor compared to how well this describes the experience in terms a therapist would probably find useful.

[Combatting Cult Mind Control] (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0892813113/ref=oh_details_o07_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) Steve Hassan was in the Moonies but the methods are the same. Freaked me out when I first read it.

I'm Perfect, You're Doomed If you haven't read this yet, I highly recommend it. It's hard to get through sometimes because she's not always likeable and sometimes really pathetic, but weren't we all?

1. Crisis of Conscience. 2) The Gentile Times Reconsidered. 3) Jehovah's Witnesses And The United Nations. 4) The Early History of God: Yahweh and the Other Deities in Ancient Israel (Biblical Resource Series). 5) The God Delusion.

Available now

[Crisis of Conscience: The story of the struggle between loyalty to God and loyalty to one's religion. - Kindle edition by Raymond Franz, Deborah Dykstra, David ...]
(https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07B7C21M3/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_4?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1520187343&sr=1-4-fkmr0&keywords=crisis+of+conscience+raymond+franz+2018)

That Watchtower article is crap - you must always independently research Watchtower.


Here's the link to Amazon where the book can be ordered from:
https://www.amazon.com/Crisis-Conscience-struggle-between-religion/dp/0999499211/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1539476363&sr=8-1&keywords=crisis+of+conscience+by+raymond+franz

​

Best of luck

Funny enough there is a book about JWs with almost your exact wording. "I'm Perfect, Youre doomed"

Yikes. Hey, if you told MIL you didn't want your kid to wear blue on Tuesday, she should respect that. Doesn't matter what you ask... your kid, your rules.

I googled "Jehovah's views on spanking" and was shown this. Looked interesting... I think it's worth a read. Might help you get in her head...

Biography of Raymond Franz


Excerpts


>In 1944 Franz graduated from Gilead, the group's school for training missionaries, and temporarily served the organization as a traveling representative in the continental United States until receiving a missionary assignment to Puerto Rico in 1946. Franz became a representative of Jehovah's Witnesses throughout the Caribbean, traveling to the Virgin Islands and the Dominican Republic, until at least 1957 when Jehovah's Witnesses were banned in the Dominican Republic by dictator Rafael Trujillo. At the age of 37, Franz married his wife, Cynthia, who joined him on missionary work. Both returned to the Dominican Republic in 1961 to evangelize for four more years and were then assigned to Watch Tower headquarters in Brooklyn, New York.

Source:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raymond_Franz

In his book, Crisis of Conscience, Franz talks about his days in the Dominican R, page 19 (Spanish edition):

> During a period of almost 5 years that we stayed in the country, we saw the fall of four different governments and in April 1965 we experimented a war in the surroundings of the capital (Santo Domingo) Translated by me.

Source:

https://www.amazon.com.mx/Crisis-Conscience-struggle-between-religion-ebook/dp/B07B7C21M3/ref=sr_1_1?__mk_es_MX=%C3%85M%C3%85%C5%BD%C3%95%C3%91&crid=CHM8SVLF16CH&keywords=crisis+of+conscience&qid=1550170558&s=gateway&sprefix=Crisis+of+C%2Caps%2C338&sr=8-1


Source of the Photo and Web Page ...Tribute to...

In Tribute to Cynthia and Raymond Franz


https://www.commentarypress.com/








We want to ask the members of the Governing Body of the Jehovah's Witnesses:


> Why did you erase the work of Raymond Franz in his missionary work in the 2015 Yearbook?

> Why are you coping with Stalin's, Chairman Mao Ze Dong's ways to erase friends, comrades of struggle?


Source:

Stalin manipulated the science of photography to further his own political career and to erase the memory of his victims. In each case, the juxtaposition of original and doctored images reveals how easily history can be distorted.

https://www.history101.com/photo-altering-soviet-union/


More people erased by dictators:

https://www.businessinsider.com/people-who-were-erased-from-history-2013-12#leon-trotsky-russian-revolutionary-3

Manipulators of China's history:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/08/chinas-memory-manipulators



The Borg Manipulation to erase Franz work

In 1954, Trujillo traveled to Rome and signed a concordat with the Pope. Trujillo’s one-time confidant, Germán Ornes, wrote: “Since the Dominican Church is overwhelmingly pro-Trujillo, [it] has been a great source of support for ‘the Chief’ [Trujillo].

https://www.jw.org/en/publications/books/2015-yearbook/history/catholic-church-trujillo/

Jehovah’s loyal servants had to be courageous in the face of such violent opposition—and courageous they were! Even government officials recognized this. For example, on July 31, 1957, Luis Arzeno Colón, an inspector for the president, wrote to the secretary of state, lamenting: “Although the law recently proclaimed by the National Congress declares illegal the religious activity of the sect known as Jehovah’s Witnesses, the majority of its members continue in their steadfastness.”

https://www.jw.Borg/en/publications/books/2015-yearbook/history/vicious-attack/

Shortly thereafter, Secretary of Security Arturo Espaillat ordered the ten remaining missionaries to leave the country. On July 21, 1957, Roy Brandt wrote to Trujillo, requesting to meet with him to explain our situation.

https://www.jw.org/en/publications/books/2015-yearbook/history/head-witness/


Sorry GB, you can Stalinize the Memory of Cynthia and Raymond Franz, but they will always live in the hearts and minds of people in FREEDOM

I'm just posting this for information. I have no connection with the book and haven't read it.

.

Shunned: How I Lost my Religion and Found Myself

>Linda A. Curtis, 256-Page Paperback, Released April 17, 2018

>Linda Curtis was raised as a Jehovah’s Witness and is an unquestioning true believer who has knocked on doors from the time she was nine years old. Like other Witnesses, she has been discouraged from pursuing a career, higher education, or even voting, and her friendships are limited to the Witness community.

>Then one day, at age thirty-three, she knocks on a door - and a coworker she deeply respects answers the door. To their mutual consternation she launches into her usual spiel, but this time, for the first time ever, the message sounds hollow. In the months that follow, Curtis tries hard to overcome the doubts that spring from that doorstep encounter, knowing they could upend her “safe” existence. But ultimately, unable to reconcile her incredulity, she leaves her religion and divorces her Witness husband - a choice for which she is shunned by the entire community, including all members of her immediate family.

>Shunned follows Linda as she steps into a world she was taught to fear and discovers what is possible when we stay true to our hearts, even when it means disappointing those we love.

>https://www.amazon.com/Shunned-Lost-Religion-Found-Myself/dp/1631523287/

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See also:

• https://lindaacurtis.com
  
  
• https://lindaacurtis.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Leaving-TheFold-ebook.pdf
  
  
• https://lindaacurtis.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Honorable-Closure-Ebook-Final.pdf

Google brings up "Faith on the March" by A H MacMillian, "The Truth that leads to Eternal Life", and "I'm Perfect, You're Doomed" which is satire.

Yeah. Get on this right away. Check out the book on Amazon called "Before You Open the Door." It hasn't a great section on what to do if a loved one starts getting targeted by JWs.

https://www.amazon.com/Before-You-Open-Door-Witnesses-ebook/dp/B00MNJ1H5S

Staying in could help your brotherover time.
Sounds like this mother who got reinstated to get her daughter out. Then both faded...

https://www.amazon.com/Going-Undercover-Rescue-My-Daughter/dp/0941813053

Has anybody read this?

I really enjoyed Kyria Abrams' memoir I'm Perfect, You're Doomed.

I'd suggest making a post on /r/exjw and possibly /r/exmormon. The people there will be familiar with this and give you advice to get him out of it.

I saw this posted in this thread so I'll paste it here for you:

>Yeah. Get on this right away. Check out the book on Amazon called "Before You Open the Door." It hasn't a great section on what to do if a loved one starts getting targeted by JWs.

>https://www.amazon.com/Before-You-Open-Door-Witnesses-ebook/dp/B00MNJ1H5S

Crisis of Conscience https://www.amazon.com/dp/0999499211/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_9WHzCbMPB3A85

He will love this book, it's a must have for every JW.

You can get this book on Amazon. Interesting.
In US I found this link...

https://www.amazon.com/Years-Watchtower-Slave-Confessions-Converted/dp/0801063841

​

https://www.amazon.com/Crisis-Conscience-struggle-between-religion-ebook/dp/B07B7C21M3/

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Crisis-Conscience-struggle-between-religion-ebook/dp/B07B7C21M3/

It looks like they're still in stock ;)

WHen he first started activism he did not show his face and was still a JW. So he used John Cedars . https://www.amazon.com/Reluctant-Apostate-Leaving-Jehovahs-Witnesses-ebook/dp/B01N4V1WRA/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1540038983&sr=8-3&keywords=jehovah%27s+witnesses

Go ask around on r/ExMormon, r/ExJW, read I'm Perfect, You're Doomed by Kyria Abrahams. Celibacy for religious purposes is an anachronism in the age of condoms and birth control. It doesn't help anyone anymore.

Hardcover

Paperback

Very excited. I never got to read this and I need to make a decision soon

Tami Dickerson wrote a book about this and has all the documents supporting the claims included. It's only $1.99 on Kindle at Amazon. I downloaded it early on while doing research on the org.

Crisis of Conscience: The story of the struggle between loyalty to God and loyalty to one's religion. https://www.amazon.com/dp/0999499211/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_vgdpDbJYRG69T

Sure is - Amazon link here (I'm presuming you're in the US) - it was written by a former member of the JWs' governing body.

My wife is an ex-jw. She likes the following books in part because they inject lots of humor into their painful accounts of living in the system, and then leaving it:

I'm Perfect, You're Doomed: Tales from a Jehovah's Witness Upbringing by Kyria Abrahams

and

Confessions of a Teenage Jesus Jerk by Tony DuShane (a fictionalized account of DuShane's life and exit from the Witnesses.)

http://www.amazon.com/The-Orwellian-World-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0802065457

I guess I should point out that this exists. I haven't read it so I cannot recommend it, but I really want to.

Here’s the link to the UK Amazon page:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0999499211/

Here's a similar book I can recall. Might want to look up publishing details about that one, maybe contact the author.

Regarding your point number 5:
https://www.amazon.ca/Orwellian-World-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0802065457

I recommend for the op to read:


The Reluctant Apostate: Leaving Jehovah's Witnesses Comes at a Price https://www.amazon.com/dp/0995669104/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_Yvz4ybHCEXS26

It's a long book but it organizes a lot of Watchtower material/fallacies/scandals. It's written with non-JWs in mind.

Amazon

https://www.amazon.com/Im-Perfect-Youre-Doomed-Upbringing/dp/1416556869

When the only versions available were for hundreds of dollars on ebay, downloading a versions from the internet might be justifiable, however, now there is a new version available, it isn't really. The kindle version is <$10

or you could request a copy through your local library.

Then direct people to this and not pirated property.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07B7C21M3/ref=tmm_kin_title_0?ie=UTF8&qid=&sr=

Available as kindle edt

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07B7C21M3/ref=mp_s_a_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1520349818&sr=8-8&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=crisis+of+conscience+by+raymond+franz&dpPl=1&dpID=51ABjkoh3ML&ref=plSrch

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0999499211/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1520391160&sr=8-1&pi=CB192198896_AA75_QL70&keywords=crisis+of+conscience

https://www.amazon.com/Crisis-Conscience-struggle-between-religion/dp/0999499203/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1524162989&sr=8-2&keywords=crisis+of+conscience+by+raymond+franz

5th edition came out this year.

https://www.amazon.com/Crisis-Conscience-struggle-between-religion/dp/0999499211

https://www.amazon.com/Crisis-Conscience-struggle-between-religion-ebook/dp/B07B7C21M3

Otherwise you may be able to find a PDF somewhere

https://www.amazon.com/dp/0999499211/ref=sr_1_3_det?ie=UTF8&qid=1520134846&sr=8-3#productPromotions

https://www.amazon.com/dp/0999499211/ref=sr_1_3_det?ie=UTF8&qid=1520134846&sr=8-3#productPromotions

https://www.amazon.com/Going-Undercover-Rescue-My-Daughter/dp/0941813053

You think Crisis blows your mind? Read The Reluctant Apostate by Lloyd Evans. It covers stuff that is in Crisis, but goes even deeper down the rabbit hole, bringing the reader pretty close to up to date on the Borg.

https://smile.amazon.com/Reluctant-Apostate-Leaving-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0995669104/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1537552743&sr=8-1&keywords=the+reluctant+apostate

A couple of books by James Penton to consider:

Apocalypse Delayed -
https://www.amazon.com/Apocalypse-Delayed-Story-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0802079733

JWs and the Third Reich -
https://www.amazon.com/Jehovahs-Witnesses-Third-Reich-Persecution/dp/0802089275

And Carl Olaf Jonsson:

Sign of the Last Days-When? -
https://www.amazon.com/Sign-Last-Days-When-Jonsson/dp/0914675095

The Gentile Times Reconsidered -
https://www.amazon.com/Gentile-Times-Reconsidered-Carl-Jonsson/dp/0914675079

You put the wrong link.

The fifth edition of the book can be found here and isn't available on hard cover through amazon yet.

https://www.amazon.com/Crisis-Conscience-struggle-between-religion-ebook/dp/B07B7C21M3/ref=sr_1_6?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1520359740&sr=1-6&keywords=crisis+of+conscience+franz

I read '1984' when I was 13 (a really dumb teacher gave it to me. Come on lady, some books you don't put into the hands of kids that young) and it scared me to death. I mean really traumatized. And it took me years to figure out why. In fact it was only a few weeks ago, and finding this subreddit when it all came together: I had grown up in 1984, we all had.

It was a pretty mindblowing revelation. And we're not the first ones to make it.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Orwellian-World-Jehovahs-Witnesses/dp/0802065457/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1382064169&sr=8-1&keywords=orwellian+world+of+jehovah

I think you're perceiving anger because I'm saying something negative about the organization, and it's making you feel defensive and angry, so you're projecting how you feel onto my words.

You're misinformed about every claim you made. If you want, you can research and see for yourself.

A few things to consider. Have you noticed that the Watchtower always bring court cases and political news stories to the congregation's attention when it has to do with them being "persecuted"? They mentioned Russia and had everyone write letters. They've talked about how they went to court and fought for their right to preach, and not to salute the flag. But they never mention the cases that accuse them of wrongdoing. They lose and settle so many of these cases, but never mention them. They never get into the details, they don't show you the supposed lies against them and how they've defended Jehovah's organization. They just tell you to believe their side of the story, without actually telling you anything about the story.

As for your claim that some witnesses made up the 1975 date, I used to believe that too. Until I saw copies of old Watchtower Publications that aren't available in the online library. You have to find a long time Jehovah's Witness that still has them. Here's a link to a page that gives a lot of sources, including audio, as to how so many JWs came to believe the end would come in 1975 https://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/1975.php

You don't have to look that far though, the Overlapping Generation is a hard one to swallow these days. Soon they'll be claiming that Jehovah's Witnesses who remember them saying that the generation of 1914 would not pass without Armageddon's arrival, had also just gotten confused and made it up. You'll see.

You can decide whether or not you want to verify it for yourself.

Lastly, I suggest you read Crisis of Conscience if you ever get a chance, and are actually interested in learning both sides.